Buyer beware

I am writing this(in addition to what was provided by the forum moderator) to help other members on this forum from getting scammed. Hopefully I am not violating any forum policy by posting this. If so I apologize. I've been searching for a set of fenders for my vehicle for several months now. I've been contacted twice by different forum members claiming they have the fenders I need. I believe it is the same person that contacted me. I was contacted once in December and once this month. What makes me believe this is someone trying to scam me is the first time this person emailed me was in December, they were a brand new member with no posts and not soon after hid his profile so you could not contact him through the forums but only via email he provided in the initial email he sent. The second response I received this month was from a different member and the same thing, can't contact him through the forums(or view his profile), only via the email he provided. Both initial emails from the supposed different members were exactly the same, it was word for word and letter for letter. I work in the IT industry so I am familiar with many types of online scams. I believe this person creates free gmail accounts and uses them to join the forums to stay hidden and under the radar. When he does successfully scam someone or someone is catching on to him, I believe he creates a new profile so he can try to scam otehrs. I asked him for a photo of the parts and he sent me a photo of a complete running car that was actually sold here on the forums several years ago that was partially restored and in very nice condition. He claimed he was parting it out. I don't see why a car that someone paid $11k for for a beautiful running vehicle would part it out. Another thing that struck me odd right off the bat was he said he will not accept PayPal because his account was dormant(I never asked him what form of payment he accepted), only accepts Western Union or a money gram. This way he can't be tracked down. With PayPal, you have to provide personal bank account/credit card info, etc to be able to use their service. So things to help watch out for...is the member profile hidden? Is it a new profile? Can you contact them via forums? Are they using one of the free email services like gmail, yahoo, hotmail, etc? Are they asking for a wire gram or Western Union payment? Just one of these isn't enough to consider it a scam, but put them all together and I'll bet you it is. Hope this saves someone from making any mistakes in the future. It's harder to scam an informed person.

I always ask the seller for specific photos or angles of photos of the car/part. If they state, "my camera is broken" or send you something different than what you asked for, it's more than likely a scam. No photo....no purchase.

I ran into the same scam trying to buy fenders, money gram and all. Apparently if you need fenders, you need to be careful.

Paypal is no guarantee either... I've had scammers that insisted on Paypal when I told him I wanted a bank certified cheque. Too bad, it makes online business riskier for everyone.

JPatino has it exactly right, any e-mail from any free service is always suspect and never gets to first base with me. After 16 years of selling parts on this and the MTFCA forum I have been very fortunate in not being scammed, either as a buyer or seller. I also never respond to any suspect e-mail as I do not want "them" to recognize me as an active account. So, use your delete button and never worry if you ignored the wrong person, if they are seriously interested they will call or try again.

Could someone explain the "free email service " problem. I've used Hotmail for years, am I branded a scammer?

Is there some kind of protection if you pay for email service? I have an email service available through my internet provider

but Hotmail is much easier to use. Never had a problem.

I hate to take up space in the for sale section , but this is where the conversation started.

Thanks for input.

Roy

I have a gmail account also. It's convenient and I don't have to worry about changing email addresses if I were to change internet providers. It's easy to create an account for free. You can create as many free accounts as you like and that's where it makes it easy for scammers. I maintain a spam filter for my office and a good amount of spam comes from these free accounts. I do see them from pay accounts but it's very little compared to the free accounts. I only mentioned it from experience and what I encountered with this person. Both addresses came from a gmail account. Let's say I told everyone the guys address was John@gmail.com. He sees my post and within minutes, creates a new gmail account and names it jason1@gmail.com and creates a new forum user. It's much easier to do this with free accounts than pay accounts.

whtbaron makes a good point too.

With specific apologies to Roysboystoys (who is an excellent person to deal with) most of the suspected scammers have used the free accounts. I don't automatically delete any. When one opens the suspect e-mail one can tell by the sentence structure if they are legit.

Every single wanted ad I have placed on this forum has been followed by scam attempts. I kind of enjoy stringing them along now, the give away is always when you ask for specific photos as said above.

Thanks for the input . I get few scammers. I think Hotmail does a good job of ID ing them.

I do have a few problems with buyers that lock up an item and never follow through.

Seems like the problem shows up when placing a Wanted ad, not so much a for sale ad.

I have yet to have a problem with any one on this forum , Hotmail does issue a warning with each notice though.

Thanks for that.

I received an email from another member who turns out received a message from the same person that tried to scam me.

jpatino,

If you determine that a scammer has registered as a member here, please send me or another moderator a PM with the details so we can ban the scammer. Any user with zero posts that responds to a wanted ad by a PM would be immediately suspect to me.

Thanks Arnzy55

jpatino,

This is exactly what I'm going through now. I'm a newbie to AACA and this forum. I am looking for fenders and doors for my 1955 Buick so I posted. Low and behold 1 of 2 responds was from someone saying they were "breaking" their 55 Century for parts and to private message them. So I did and they said their Pay-Pal was dormant and they would take Western Union. I said I needed to see pictures so the next day I get 7 pictures of a very nice 55 Century.....with Californis plates on it, which traced to Fusion Auto Auction in San Diego Ca. the Fusion website shows the exact same pictures of the same car listed as SALE PENDING!! I did recieve a mailing address to send the Western Union payment near Bakersfield Ca. Do you think I should?? NOT!

Thanks again Arnzy55

I'm sure it is the same person. I wonder just how many people he tried to scam. I sent you an email McHinson. Thanks again. I'm sure this guy is probably reading the forum and is saying to himself "the jig is up".

Had that happen to me twice this month. I think a big red flag is when they want you to contact them via email vs. using the forum.

Paypal is no guarantee either... I've had scammers that insisted on Paypal when I told him I wanted a bank certified cheque. Too bad, it makes online business riskier for everyone.

I actually would highly recommend paypal for transactions happening over the internet between strangers. The key to getting the most protection out of paypal is to pay with your credit card through paypal. This way you get someprotection from paypal as well as the protections offered through your credit card company. Paypal is a sophisticated operation, as are most credit card companies meaning that they can track and trace your transactions with incredible detail. Perhaps I'm paranoid, but I won't even send a personal check to someone I've never met or don't know. It's much easier to preserve my financial anonymity with paypal.The only people that get checks are freinds/family and major organizations with known addresses. For everyone else, it's paypal via credit card.

NEVER EVER pay with Western Union or Money Gram. That is probably the #1 sign of a scam. Payments made that way are untraceable and is the equivalent to sending cash to a stranger (and I think we're all smart enough to never mail cash).

Genuine postal service money orders are far safer and CAN be replaced if damaged, lost, or stolen. There is now even a number you can call into before accepting a money order to verify that it is in fact a real one. Any funny business with a postal money order = mail fraud = federal crime and can land folks in a lot of trouble.

For high dollar transactions, I'd urge everyone to be careful with wire transfers, too. I highly recommend asking your bank to setup a temporary account for one time use to send or receive a wire. In the event of a scam, this prevents the scammer/hacker from having your real bank account information. Most banks are happy to help you do this once you explain to them what you have in mind and why.

It always pays to carefully document your transactions regardless of how you decide to pay. And for those of you that sell stuff, it's ALWAYS worth it to get tracking and delivery confirmation on your packages in case things go bad.

Personally, I've always thought it was pretty easy to figure out the legitimacy of a deal. I always ask specific questions, ask for specific photos, and keep at it until I'm satisfied. ALWAYS get a mailing address BEFORE you fire off that payment (even with paypal) and google the address to see if it makes sense. If google maps takes me to an empty lot, to a post office building, or a high rise office tower in the middle of NYC, chances are I'm not going to end up with my stuff. If it seems to good to be true or the elements of the deal just don't add up, run away.

But don't blame the email addresses. I have several email addresses, including yahoo, gmail (more than one of those, too), and corporate (employer) emails. In fact, I've used a gmail address since 2004 when they were still beta testing. I use a gmail address for all of my personal business, yahoo only for ebay business, and corporate only for work related matters and don't give that one out. Gmail is by far the easiest to use and offers the most features such as web access (meaning look at it from anywhere with an internet connection), virtually unlimited storage, and near universal/widespread usage. A scammer could just as easily be using a comcast, sbcglobal, aol, etc. email address. There are over 400 MILLION active gmail accounts. If you refuse to correspond with someone just because of that, you're missing out on connecting with a lot of folks.

Scammers are an unfortunate part of any hobby. We've just all got to keep our eyes open and actively take steps to not be victimized.

I would say it depends on the dollar amount . I have many people send me cash in the mail , up to $35.00.

I take checks up to $40.00 from first time buyers , and any amount from people I've dealt with.

I usually ask for postal money orders , but if I know the person any money order is acceptable.

I've found that most people are honest and legit ,haven't been burned yet.

First time posters are handled with caution and questions.

When you're talking a major purchase or sending down payment, every caution is needed to protect yourself.

I'm on several forums , and I realize this forum does have a scammer problem.

Not sure why it's not so much a problem on the others.