Chrysler straight eight questions

Some time back, like a year or 2, I found a Chrysler Straight Eight engine in a junkyard. It was powering the yard crane, long since gone out of service.

The engine was a straight eight flathead Chrysler with a 2 barrel carburetor which I believe would date it about 1950. Sorry I did not get the serial number. It is probably an industrial engine although it could have been taken from a car. But it appeared to be the original engine, not something that was adapted.

I was thinking of buying this engine to build a "special" or Speedster I had in mind, on a 1955 Plymouth frame. The Plymouth came with the Canadian flathead six which was basically the DeSoto/Chrysler six cylinder engine, detuned.

The question is, could I fit the straight eight to the six's manual transmission using the flywheel, clutch, bellhousing etc from the 55 Plymouth? Can the same starter be used?

I also have heard that some Chrysler straight eight parts have grown very scarce and impossible to find. Any truth to this? Anything else I should look out for?

Rusty...

The Chrysler industrial engines could be different but it's probably a 1947 or earlier engine. 2BBL engines were built up through 1947 as std in the chryslers. In 1948 a 1BBL carb was used on the 2 BBL intake with an adapter. A new single bore intake was used on 1949 and the 1950 models-last year of the eight. Most all parts are available to rebuild the 323 eight,except for the crank gear. You have to do some searching though!

The eight cylinder crank has a eight hole crank flange but you can bolt a "4" bolt 6 cylinder flywheel to it. You cannot put a six flathead bell housing to the eight block. The bolt pattern and shape is completely different. You would have to drill the rear of the "8" bell housing for the six cylinder 3 speed transmission. The 3 speed trans bearing retainer diameter could be different-smaller than the fluid drive 3 speed or M5/M6 transmission. When you need it I have a Edmunds aluminum dual 1 barrel intake manifold to put on your new straight eight project!

That could make things "interesting". As it is an industrial engine powering a crane I don't believe it has a bellhousing as such, at least not one that would work with a car transmission. What is more, so far as I know, all straight eights after 1938 came with Fluid Drive.

So, it sounds like it would be quite a job to put a manual trans on this engine unless I can find a 1938 str8 bellhousing and trans.

How about Fluid Drive, would a Fluid Drive bellhousing off a six cylinder Chrysler or DeSoto fit?

Edited February 25, 2013 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history)

Yes Rusty..

The only bell housings for Chryslers was the FD longer housing. Either use the FD coupling and clutch with a FD 3 speed or use a lon input shaft FD 3 speed and make up a special longer input shaft bearing retainer for the longer bell housing. 1953-56? dodge cars used a weird real long input shaft bearing retainer and long throw out bearing and sleeve assembly-about 10" long. I have seen them on ebay.

Some pics of a Mopar six and 323 eight rear block mounting and bolt patterns and a mix of Mopar flathead sixes.

Edited February 26, 2013 by c49er (see edit history)

Thanks for the pictures, they really clear things up.

I think the easiest way would be to use the six cylinder engine. As I would have to move the engine back about a foot to get the look I want, maybe I should move it back an extra 6" in case I ever get a straight eight.

It was supposed to be a quick fun project, a simple boat tail speedster body patterned after the 1931 Auburn.

Rusty,

I wouldn't give up on that straight 8 so quickly! It would definitely be impressive in a speedster. I don't know about Chrysler products but running, even restored Buick and Packard straight 8's with their transmissions still bolted on, show up regualrly on ebay and craigslist. Rodders pull them to install SBC's. They have alot of trouble selling them, and most seem to go for under $1000. (I have been thinking about a speedster project too!)

Dwight

Rusty,

I wouldn't give up on that straight 8 so quickly! It would definitely be impressive in a speedster. I don't know about Chrysler products but running, even restored Buick and Packard straight 8's with their transmissions still bolted on, show up regularly on ebay and craigslist. Rodders pull them to install SBC's. They have alot of trouble selling them, and most seem to go for under $1000. (I have been thinking about a speedster project too!)

Dwight

Check out this thread from the speedster forum. He is using a 6 cyl 413 CI Chrysler industrial engine:http://forums.aaca.org/f230/super-sized-speedster-341398.html

Rusty,

I know a gentlemen near Pittsburgh PA that has a 38 chrysler c19 transmission for sale. I believe that would bolt up to a c23 straight eight.

I'm fasinated by the Dodge truck engine picture c49er posted...........Dual carbs! I'd like to know more about it.

Edited March 4, 2013 by HarryJ (see edit history)

Give me a call. I have a hand full of the 8 flatt, along with speed stuff.Also have the bell housing that goes behind the ind flatt 8. Have 2 complete units that came out of the orchards to move the air around when it gets cold. Might be of help. 209-613-1199:cool:

Edited March 4, 2013 by countrytravler (see edit history)

I'm fasinated by the Dodge truck engine picture c49er posted...........Dual carbs! I'd like to know more about it.

It's a 1953 Dodge truck 413 engine.

My 2 cents. A similar project, straight-8/323 with 38 Imperial transmission/OD (did do some homework beforehand, should be the most sturdy combo). And even an Edmunds intake to take twin Strombergs (found one modified for a boat engine). Everything put into the chassis of a Series 65 Chrysler with the radiator set 4" rearwards, and a body prop made out of foam for body mock-up and preparing to install 20" knock-off wheels. Then of course everything did take a lull, but I'll be back.

Reckon using a narrow 20's/30's frame is easier for proper proportions than trying out with a 50's chassis. A double drop 31/32 would possibly be ideal?

Narve I am very impressed with your car. That is more or less what I had in mind to do.

You are right about the chassis. I can't see how to make it work. One problem I just thought of today, the steering wheel is too far to the left for a narrow 30s body and there is no easy way to change it. On the whole it would be better to use an older chassis, or if I want to use the 55 chassis, to build a different style of body like a fifties sports car or something along those lines.

Restoring and racing 50s fibreglass sportscars (non-GM) seem to be all the rage now, so that could be a good idea.

How is your project doing?

Just a note regarding the bellhousing/trans query. Last year I was asked to make an adapter for the L8 to mount a Torqueflight trans. I was able to modify one of my L6 block adapters (not pretty, but then it was a prototype...) but the crank flange dimensions were entirely different and a one-off drive plate was designed for the combination.

Being that I am in Oregon (without an L8 in the shop) and the customer was in Connecticut, we had a 'fun' time.

The block adapter will support any of the Mopar small-block bellhousings but for a manual transmission the flywheel may be the sticky point due to the dimensions. One-off flywheels will be a bit expensive.

All that said, a manual transmission is doable, but if you don't have a machine shop handy then a checkbook is a must.

Narve N, you have a great looking package with interesting looking trans/bell pieces. The flywheel in the foregroung looks to be huge. Can you offer any details on the parts you are using?

Edited April 14, 2013 by Wayfarer (see edit history)

The engine is a standard 323 cui (roughly post-war, could be anything 40 or newer). This originally came with a Fluid Drive as most if not all at that time, so to avoid slipping (memories from almost getting stuck with my 40 New Yorker at the low end of a deep (200+ ft BSL) underwater tunnel starts flowing here) I went for 38 Imperial parts as recommended by Martin Swig many years ago. Apparently 37 Imperial was plagued by a too small clutch to its vehicle weight,and the 38 took care of that. In 39 came the FD so the 38 is the optimum manual transmission?

The flywheel in the front is for the 38 and has since been machined to fit the engine, but not installed yet. Behind is the 3-speed transmission and manual overdrive from the 38

Bump

Does anyone know if the 4.875" stroke crank from the 324 Chrysler straight 8 will fit the 299 or 274 blocks?  I believe the 274 has a shorter deck height than the 324 (by approximately an 1/8" IIRC) which would require shorter pistons but it appears all three engines used the same main bearings.  Also, I'm looking for a dual carburetor intake for the Chrysler straight 8.  Any leads appreciated.