Horned Toad '62 Valiant will be following me home

BLEACH, yes, it's a '67. The VIN starts with VL21B, so that means I've got me another 225, which is very good. This will be my year-round daily driver, until I get the '62 back together. Let's hope one can still buy 13" snow tires and that the heater is better than the one I remember in my dad's '66 Valiant.

BLEACH, yes, it's a '67. The VIN starts with VL21B, so that means I've got me another 225, which is very good. This will be my year-round daily driver, until I get the '62 back together. Let's hope one can still buy 13" snow tires and that the heater is better than the one I remember in my dad's '66 Valiant.

If you have trouble finding 13" snow tires, try to find a set of Dodge Dart '67-'69 V8 small bolt pattern 14" wheels. They will bolt right on and tires are a little easier to find for 14". You will possibly have to change the speedometer gear in the tailshaft to a different ratio for the 14" wheel/tire change.

My grandmother left me a 1969 Valiant 225 two door sedan and it was a GREAT car. Kept up with San Diego/L.A. traffic quite well. Even NOT during the rush hour!

The '63 Dart I had felt nearly like a muscle car. It had the 225 and automatic. I don't know how it was geared but I'm sure it's wasn't too tall. It would do 70 on the freeways without any effort or sign of topping out. It took the hills north of L.A. on I-5 with out needing to downshift. Again doing 70 was no problem there either and it felt it could do more. It still got good MPG's no mater how hard it was pushed. I miss that car. It wasn't the greatest looking car. I never did care for it's loose resemblance to the Chrysler Turbine. The stylists could have done better. I still liked it for everything else.

My mom had a 68 Dart that had 300,000 miles on the 225. She gave it up because the radiator went bad. I put a radiator in it and sold it for more than she paid for it new., That car got over 30 mpg on the freeway, of coarse she didn't drive very fast.

Great little cars those A-bodys.

I think Plymouth missed an opportunity when they discontinued the Valiant station wagon after 1966. The next body style would have made a great wagon, with its already boxy shape. Clearly, Chrysler realized its error and resurrected the wagon for the third generation of the A-body, the Volare and Aspen. They sold a heap of those and one stills sees them around, those which didn't rust away.

Valiant VF Estate Car, Australia

MY dad had a 67 or 68 and have never seen another one quite like it. this is close even though it is a 2 door and dad had a four door. Now I know we have all heard before at car shows: MY dad had one just like it except it was white, 4 door, different year and different make! His had the same wheel covers as yours, 270 V8 with AC and a four door. it was no slouch. Just don't let it sit more than 1 day in raining conditions or it will not start!

CHAD, my dad had a '61 Fury, then a '66 Valiant, and both were often hard to start. Although he was no mechanic, he got pretty good at the tricks of getting the choke to do what it was designed to do.

I don't recall anyone from my youth who owned this vintage of Valiant but my uncle did buy a new '68 Dart, when he retired. He didn't want any options, not even a radio, but the salesman tried anyway to coax him into a few extras. "It'll be good at trade-in time," he argued. Uncle Alex said no thanks, this was the last car he was ever going to buy, so resale value was irrelevant.

As luck and good health would have it, Alex was still driving his trusty Dart twenty years later. The poor thing was rusted, leaky, and just plumb worn out. He limped it into a Honda dealership and, being 85 years old himself, he sought out the oldest salesman on the floor. Amazingly, it was the same man who had sold him the Dart! As they made a deal on a new Accord coupe, the subject of a trade-in came up. "Sorry, I can only give you $200 for the Dodge. See? I told you you should have added some options!"

When I was in high school (graduated in '70), a local electrical company had a few D-100 stepside trucks for their service trucks. Few options, but had the 225 Slant Six and 3-speed manual trans. The owner's son (my age) would brag about "2nd gear rubber, from a standing start". Everybody laughed . . . until he did it.

Later, another friend had a large paper route. He started driving Valiants (mid-60s models). He'd load up the 4-door's interior with papers and head out in the wee hours of the morning before school. The famous Chrysler handling came in handy as he criss-crossed unoccupied streets to throw the papers on BOTH sides of the street in one pass. Those cars were bullet-proof, it seemed, which made me smile. IF he had any real mechanical issues, it was usually the rear axles, which would lock up. He ended up having two at one time, when one axle would fail, he used the other car . . . and vice versa. After several hundred thousand miles, he'd look for another one . . . and find a nice one, generally. He did most of his own mechanical work, too.

There are some interesting articles in Allpar.com by the Slant Six engine designer! He claims the 170 was a better engine than the 225 . . . of all things! Plus mention of the Australian six cylinder which came later!

A good while back, the Walter P. Chrysler club magazine had a very extensive article on the Plymouth Valiants. One surprising thing was that the torsion bar front end was a down-sized version of the '57 suspension, both of which were designed at the same time. PLUS, the floorpans were the same from the start to the finish of the Valiant line! That would mean that all of the later suspension items should bolt-into the earlier cars!

For some really interesting and amusing reading, you might find some of the older copies of Mopar Muscle Magazine where they chronicled their exploits of a '69 Valiant 2-dr sedan, originally owned by their local utility company . . . in other words, a "base car" in all respects. It was upgraded with a warmed-up 360 V-8, later model suspension and disc brakes, radial tires, and other budget-upgrades, too. End result they ran it at Road Atlanta and smoked LOTS of more expensive foreign and domestic "sports cars" of the middle 1980s! The very hilarious parts of the article mentioned how they needed to have a safety inspection done before they got to the track, which they got at a Sears Auto Center on the way to the track. As they were passing slower cars on the track, with a track person as passenger, they mentioned the disc brake upgrade and such, plus the 19.95 "auto supply special" brake pads and rear brake shoes, yet the car was out-braking many "more expensive brands" and not having any problems doing it. They dubbed it "The Green Brick".

If somebody tried to do something of that nature today, they'd have to have lots of aftermarket high-end parts and such, but in that earlier time, the main source was the salvage yard . . . knowing WHAT to get from WHAT Chrysler products. Plus that Chrysler built "combination cars" back then . . . if the engine and power was upgraded, the suspension and chassis components received upgrades to make everything work as well as it could . . . rather than just dropping in a bigger motor and calling it "good". Obviously, the Formula S Valiants had upgraded stuff, as they competed successfully in many "dirt-road" rallyes of that time. Just as the later 340-engined cars got appropriate upgrades, too.

Seems like one of the first S/S drag racers was a '62 Valiant wagon with a Chrysler 413 in it?

CONGRATS on the Valiants for your project and daily-use cars! Please keep us posted on your progress! Styling on the first-gen cars was definitely unique, but looked pretty spiffy in the right colors and color combinations. To me, the '67 cars were some of the nicest looking designs. The '73-'74 models were the "luxury models", having velour and such.

The A cars had factory a/c systems which were "under-dash" systems with compressors which cycled . . . just like the after-market add-on systems did. BUT . . . all it took to convert them to non-cycling systems (as the larger C-body cars had) was to unplug the cycling switch and insert an EPR valve into the a/c compressor's input-side line! The compressors were the same, just different ways of modulating the gas flow! Quite easy to do! PLUS, to convert them to R-134a, just turn the adjusting/calibration screw 1/2 turn CCW to slightly lower the evaporator pressure from 29.5 to 26.0. With that little adjustment, 40 degree F vent temperatures will return, with a slightly smaller freon load.

Enjoy!

NTX5467

Great write up NTX!

And here I was thinking that no one cared about Slant Sixes and Valiants anymore! Thanks, Nittix and Bleach, for renewing my faith in the inclusiveness of our hobby. They sure don't have the following of Chrysler's showier muscle cars but I'm glad that some folks still remember them fondly.

The seller of my '67 kindly picked me up at SeaTac airport early this morning and drove me to the shop that did the mechanical inspection last week. I left the car there for the whole day so they could tackle some "deferred maintenance" items, involving the cooling system and the brakes. Those would be two essentials for mountain range-crossing, I think. The Valiant offered up some last minute glitches at the end of the day, causing me to be held over in Seattle for the night, awaiting parts arriving tomorrow morning.

Well, there's worse places to be stranded, so I hopped on a bus and headed downtown. Found a very cool boutique hotel near Pikes Place Market and have spent the evening exploring Belltown, which is Seattle's hoppin' hospitality district.

I still haven't driven my new Daily Driver but I am pleased with its overall condition, even its honest battle scars. No plans to ever have it repainted but instead I have an idea for "tatoos", to cover up some unsightly areas of failed paint. With some black enamel and a good sable paintbrush, I think I can imbue some Seattle Grunge character that the original owner - reportedly an elderly woman who drove it for 35 years - would not have imagined.

There's a great site dedicated to the slant six. They also have some great tech articles. Check them out. Slant Six Forum

I've dabbled in the Slant Six Forum and have a bookmark set on For A-Bodies Only. They are useful for technical queries but the overwhelming theme is hotrodding and massive performance upgrades. I happen to like Valiants just as they rolled out of the showrooms. They are adequately powered, economical to operate, and have a Cheap & Cheerful attitude that makes me smile. That's why I prefer this AACA Plymouth forum for regular chat - no one here seems obsessed with quarter-mile times and there are plenty of good Slant Six memories to share.

Car trouble. Or rather, mechanic trouble. After paying a staggering bill at the shop in Seattle (unexpected complications), I hit the I-5 northbound. Within 20 minutes, the temperature gauge pinned over to the right and clouds of steam billowed out behind the Valiant. The mechanic had forgotten to tighten radiator cap. No biggie, an hour delay and a gallon of antifreeze and I was on the road again.

Nine o'clock last night I started up the long, long grade of the Coquihalla Highway in British Columbia. It's the kind of road that brings 18-wheelers to their knees - flashers on, creeping along in the far right-hand lane. I eyed the temperature gauge and was pleased to see it holding at the three-quarter mark, while the car managed a steady 100 kph (65 mph), zipping past the semis. Then, POW! Steam again. I was able to pull over at an intersection with a street light and quickly saw that a brand-new hose had blown off the bottom radiator fitting. With my fingers, I checked some of the other hose clamps and found half of them were loose, barely even closed.

Cursing out the $100-an-hour mechanic, I saved some harsh words for myself, too. In my delayed eagerness to get out of town, I'd completely forgotten to stop by a Pep Boys or a Harbour Freight, to pick up a cheap set of tools and some oil, brake fluid, and antifreeze. Pretty essential, wouldn't you say, for an 800-mile journey across several mountain ranges, in a 46 year-old car that I had just met? I paid for that big-time last night, folded into the back seat of an obsolete economy car, after swatting mosquitoes for two hours, trying to hitch a ride. Someone finally took pity on me early this morning. I am now on my way again, with at least a ten hour drive ahead of me. This time, I have a trunk full of the sort of greasy things that our fathers always carried on a long road trip.

Rotten luck, Rob.

I'm glad you're safe and that you were able to get some help.

Good luck the rest of the way home!

Ike

With all of the inconveniences, I'm glad it was more "installer error" than "mechanical error"! There DOES seem to be a spirit in many vehicles that they were MORE than mere appliances, but "beings" which you can have a good working relationship with. BUT, just as with any other being, some attention to details (which the high-priced mechanics seemed NOT to have) can be necessary. In many observed cases, vehicles which get kicked, cussed/swore at, or physically "beat upon" CAN reciprocate in some way or another. In other cases, those that regularly got "rode hard and put up wet" seemed to enjoy standing up to their owners/drivers as a sign of defiance . . . better than any Timex watch ever could!

Hope you have a nice trip for the rest of the distance! May Mother Mopar look after you and your new purchase!

NTX5467

I did have another rad hose blow off, shortly after my last update. I was prepared that time and managed to get back underway without assistance. After that, the car ran perfectly all the way home.

One can drive on the highway in this Valiant with the windows wide open because it's equally noisy, whether they're up or down. Sound insulation was not a factor in this car's design. You could compare its aerodynamics with those of a brick, except a brick doesn't have a side mirror to generate even more wind noise.

The sloped 225 engine has adequate power and is admirably smooth. First and second gear are used for the first few seconds of takeoff only; third gear suffices for the rest of the drive. First is not well synchronized, tending to issue a short, nostalgic grind, but I soon achieved quiet, sedate launches at the stop lights. 3-on-the-tree is a novelty with a short best-before date.

The front seat was comfortable for the entire trip and the control layout is good. The driver's door needs some adjustment; it needs a good slamming, which is hard to do because the armrest is missing. It was no doubt broken because of all the slamming. Remarkably, that arm rest, parts of the seat covers, the rear floor mats, and the grille centre emblem are the only pieces that need replacing.

About a third of the car was repainted at some time and that paint has died. The sheet metal is generally straight and absolutely rust-free. The original paint might respond well to one last polishing, although it is down to the primer in places. As I was killing time while the Seattle shop squandered my money, I starting "tatooing" the bare spots with some model paint and a couple of cheap brushes. Looks better than bare primer, if I do say so myself. Photos will follow.

Honestly, I do not love this car, not yet anyway. It's basically the same as my '62 Signet but minus the style and flair. That's just as well, though, because it could motivate me to restore the older car. The '67 can serve as my Daily Driver and parts gopher, to be sold off when the job is completed.

DAVE, there you go, bringing out the hotrod heritage of these slant sixes. The sleepy Plymouth and Dodge A-body cars that rolled out of the showrooms couldn't be further removed from the drag strip. I guess you uncle's colleagues showed us that humans crave a challenge. All I crave is some more sound deadening and a tighter shift linkage, both of which I can eventually accomplish, if I choose to keep this dreary little car.

That's a sweet Suburban! (Did Dodge use the same term for Lancer wagons?) It probably drives just like my '67 version of the same appliance but I think that outrageous styling would make all the difference in owner satisfaction.

Couldn't answer that one.

I'm glad the Valiant made the trip with only a couple of glitches.

I had a '68 Valiant 2-door that I purchased directly from the NY Telephone Company in Buffalo in 1974. They included a quick repaint (a-la Earl Scheib) so it couldn't be mistaken for an official phone company car. All of this for the princely sum of $150.00! The car ran great and served me well for several years. Unfortunately the next owner wrecked it. I regret selling the Valiant and would get another if I found a cheapie somewhere.

Harold

HAROLD, you can have mine but I'd have to get rather more than $150 for it. It has mostly original paint and absolutely no rust, which might be considered weird in your part of the world. Oh well, a couple of winters up here and it'll be just as crusty as every other old car. By then, it will have become a cheapie.

It has mostly original paint and absolutely no rust, which might be considered weird in your part of the world. Oh well, a couple of winters up here and it'll be just as crusty as every other old car. By then, it will have become a cheapie.

The phone company Ziebarted all their fleet cars and my Valiant, though not perfect, had the least rust of any of the half-dozen or so other same-era Valiants in my parking lot.

I was attending the University of Buffalo at the time I bought the car, and sold it to a guy named Bruce. Five years later, I returned as a full time student for my master's degree and had a Grabber Blue 1970 Torino station wagon for sale (complete with wood grain....quite an eye-catching color combo). Amazingly enough, Bruce answered my newspaper ad for that car, and bought it as well! In the five years since buying my Valiant, he had gotten married, moved to Florida (where the Valiant was totaled), gotten divorced, and moved back to Buffalo.

Did it ever occur to you that Bruce was stalking you? Not surprisingly, Google Imaging "Grabber Blue Torino Squire" results in one or the other. We'll take your word for it that they materialized on the same car, at least once.

I can explain the color. I bought the Torino from one of the building custodians at the University, who was the original owner. He posted an ad on a bulletin board in the middle of the night and I saw it at about 6:30 the next morning. He told me that when the Torino was a year old, a local kid scratched the car maliciously and got caught. He demanded a color change repaint from the parents and that's how the car went from its original light blue to Grabber Blue.

Well . . . some interesting stories! Here y'all are talking about what good/great cars those earlier A-bodies were, and then, in the next sentence, about how soon you're going to get rid of them? I guess there are worse things to spend money on . . . than earlier Valiants . . . keeping everybody "out of trouble" at the same time? Another part of my brain wonders "If you're not going to keep it very long, why bother spending money on them, even if they need it, or driving through the wilds of rural Canada with a fresh purchase? Is that the 'more excitement in my life' syndrome kicking in?" :confused:

I suspect your Valiant might be in need of the "undercoat" treatment. That rubberized spray "Total Seal" (or similar), as advertised on TV, might work decently well for that, hehe. Maybe even some LizzardSkin spray? Lizzards and Horned Toads are kin, aren't they?

Y'all enjoy, now, ya hear!

NTX5467

'more excitement in my life' syndrome

NITTIX, yup, that's it. I'm busted. This was supposed to be an act of independence in my newly-single existence. Boy, did that ever backfire.

Before finally taking the wheel - AFTER the long distance purchase had been made - I had no idea I would find this Valiant so disagreeable. I'd driven and enjoyed lots of Valiants but that was forty years ago, before the auto industry truly matured. Now every tin can out of Korea rides and drives almost as nice as the best cars of the 1960s. Cheap cars of that time have been left so far behind in the evolutionary dust, that they now barely qualify as basic transportation.

Oh well, I will try to let this car grow on me, while resisting the urge to spend another dime on it. I've got two other project cars awaiting my attention and funds, so this one's simply got to go from A to B, for which it is still well equipped.

Any updates on the Toad, Rob?

I came across this shop manual for a 60 Toad being offered by another member. http://forums.aaca.org/showthread.php?t=362991

Maybe it could be useful for your 62?

Oops, it's been a while since I wandered over to the Plymouth side of the forums.

DJ, thanks for the lead on a shop manual but my Signet came with one. It combines the full-size Plymouths and compact Valiants and seems to be well-written, in Chrysler's usual way. I haven't done any work on my '62 because my '67 has needed some attention, in order to serve as dependable winter wheels. Speaking of which, it desperately needs snow tires. I'll get those installed next weekend, if I can make my way through the drifts to Canadian Tire.

I've come to quite like the "new" Val. it's crude and clattery but it has an airy openness that contrasts with the caccoon-like feel of modern cars. It starts on the second try, no matter what the temperature, and has a good heater. What more can a car guy ask for? Well, heated seats would be nice.

Good to hear about a little update. I wondered what happened to the Toad and Val.

I could only imagine how cold it can get in Edmonton but I can understand why you have such a huge shopping mall. I've only been there during the summer and it was really nice.

The next best thing to heated seats are sheepskin covers. I had them in my 84 Mercedes and it made a big difference in more ways than one. It had these horribly hard and uncomfortable MB-Tex vinyl seats, Germany's version of leather. Those covers made driving the car very pleasurable.

DJ, the mega Mall certainly is what Edmonton is known for. That and Wayne Gretzky but he hasn't played hockey here for 20 years, nor anywhere else since 1999.

I'm not even trying to run the Valiant this week. This morning's wind chill was down to that magic minus-40 mark, where it's just as freakin' cold in Celcius as it is in Fahrenheit. Too cold to be driving an ancient car but the danged dog still needs to be walked twice a day.

Funny thing about seat covers - they're not made for 2-door bench seat cars anymore.

Any updates on the 62?

I just ran across this thread... I JUST got myself a 4-door '62 V-200 Valiant - my first ever Mopar. I call him the "Road Toad".

My Toad runs, but needs brakes and some general maintenance before he can be driven. Family does not allow a LOT of time to tinker, so I'll be taking my time.

My plan is to fix up the mechanicals, get him driving, put the trim and interior back together, and leave him as-is. There is something about all the rust, faded paint, wear, and patina that really screams 'history' and appeals to me these past few years - I like to leave the old cars as-is and not restore them. Different strokes and all that. :cool:

Just thought i would drop in. thanks.

You could have Mr. Toad's wild ride if you leave the brakes as they are.

Rob and JMG, any updates on your Toads?

Nope. Life back-burnered my toad, and it got bumped out of the garage the entire Michigan winter.... Here's hoping for a productive 2015!

Those poor old ugly toads! They lead a tough life and seldom get any appreciation or completion.