upgrading ignition and carb on a 48 sedan

ive been requested to upgrade, replace the carb and dist on a 48 flat six sedan being "restored/modified by a friends shop, they want electronic ign and "a modern carb, as the originals are very worn i thought id see what mmay fly, any advice appreciated

At the risk of sounding contrary, are the upgrades being requested to "improve performance" or to "improve reliability" ?

I've been driving flathead MoPars for over twenty years and have found both the stock ignition and stock carb to be very reliable and adequate, when they are in good repair; that includes the 6-volt electrical system.

What make and model MoPar are you working on ? If it has a fluid coupling ( Dodge, De Soto, Chrysler) and semi-automatic transmission ( De Soto & Chrysler ), the carb has some specific control devices related to the tranny operations (dashpot solenoid and a kick-down switch)...

There are Pertronix electronic ignition conversions that fit the stock distributor, and I believe Langdon offers a GM HEI-disitributor to fit the flathead MoPar...

For the record, I've owned my '41 De Soto for ten years now and have put nearly 25,000 miles on it in that time; aside from points and plugs when I first bought it, I have not had to touch the ignition system and have had absolutely no problems from the carb ( Carter BB-1); It has been a "gas & oil driver". Prior drivers included a '48 New Yorker and '48 De Soto.

If your client really, really wants to "upgrade", the parts are out there; I simply want to suggest that the OEM stuff can be completely reliable if rebuilt and properly set-up. If the upgrades include conversion to 12-volts to support modern conveniences such as sound systems and A/C, then the change to electronic might be more on-line...

Just some brain-droppings... I'm thinking it's possible to make the stock gear fresh and right for what it would cost to "up-grade"... ( and some of the guys I know that have changed to electronic ignition still carry their points and condensor for a road-side retro-fit, in case the electronics crump-out...)...

Good luck !

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Post deleted by psatchwill

Pat,

The industry change to 12-volts between 1953 ( Caddy, Buick, Imperial) and 1955 was pushed by the increasing number of electrical demands on the vehicle's electrical system... mostly things like electric power windows & seats, and A/C systems, and the challenge to build a compact generator that would put-out more than 35 amps. ( This was still a few years before Ford started offering the Leece-Neville alternator on Lincoln, around '59)

Plus the savings to the manufacturers by being able to cut down on the amount of copper conductor needed to wire a vehicle, since "12-volt wire" can be about half the size of wire needed for a six-volt application.

There's talk of another industry up-grade due to power demands, I believe the current target is 48-volts ?

One factor which may be more significant to your six-volt woes in years past is that you live a colder climate than I do... I will admit that six-volts are slower to crank (start) in prolonged sub-freezing temps, especially in the days before multi-weight oils...

There's a lot of latitude for individual situations here... I guess I'm getting the impression from the various old-car forums I habituate that "you can't even think of taking a vintage car out of the driveway unless you've upgraded to power-disc brakes / radial tires / modern drivetrain /12-volts / etc"...

I have simple expectations from my '41 De Soto, and aside from plans to add an OD tranny from a 1940 De Soto, I'm happy with it the way the factory built it... under my ownership, the car has simply "worked" as-is. It is a "radio & clock delete" stripper, and I don't plan on adding those accessories, so the biggest load on the electrical system would be the headlights (not counting the starter)...

When it gets so cold that a six-volt won't start around here, the roads are usually crapped-up with salt and snow, so I wouldn't be driving the antiques anyhow.

My biggest itch about six-volts is that nobody makes a halogen version of the 7-inch sealed-beam

(6006) like they do for 12-volt vehicles ( H 6014)... I can't bring myself to put one of those flat-lensed Hella conversions on my iron... <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Peace...

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Post deleted by psatchwill

My 50 windsor would not start when damp and all I did to fix it was to get rid of the braided wire ground cable and put a regular cable on it and it would start in any weather unless it was below zero. Jeff

Frank, you and I have talked about upgrades on my 52 Windsor---most of the upgrades are for safety and ease of working on it later. I appreciate folks that leave them stock and I admire the ones that can engineer a car to work better. Mine has disc brakes up front and a Ford 9 inch in the rear--I like the floating brakes and this set up is easier to work on. I like the stock look on this car and it will stay that way. I have said before, I love the purist, but what`s wrong if a guy wants to make it better?? I am leaving the 265--six banger in but may put in a 6V alt for a more consistant charge. Switching to 12V would be nice as you can put in a nice HEI dist for a better spark----but I like the fluid drive---how to get the soleniods to work after that seems like a headache---after all this, if anybody wants to change,leave stock---it`s your car---do what you want-----nuff said........52er

Post deleted by psatchwill

Hi all, A friend of mine and the Moderator of The Forties Canadian Chrysler club, has a 1948 Chrys Windsor 4 Dr Sedan, this car is equipped with a 251 L Head 6, Fluid Drive and M5 or M6 Semi Auto Trans. He has original style brakes, all the wheel cyls and master cyl were installed new about 7 years ago, the rest was replaced at that time, lines, hoses, shoes re-lined. This brake system uses Dot 5 Silicone Fluid, there has been no issues to date, his car is parked from approximately October to April of every year, he has had no leaking wheel cyls so far and the brakes work great, before anybody gets excited, I know they are not disc brakes, but in his opinion are very good brakes when maintained and set-up properly.

He did however convert to 12 volt negative ground, this has worked well, he has the Fluid drive m5 trans, clock and radio fuel tank sending unit. These are all on voltage reducers. All of these electrics could care a less if the polarity has been switched, with the exception of the radio, not sure what he did with that, but it works.

He also has converted to electronic ignition, this was from a later model Mopar with the Slant 6 electronic ignition, there was some machining and moding to get the distributor to drop into the flattie, but not rocket science, "some folks have tried the pertronix I believe and was not happy with it's performance".

I have personally driven this car and it drives and runs great, the brakes are very good, and it starts well with the 12 volt set-up, " a 6 volt starter cranks well with 12 volt".

If you want to see this car it's in the movie "Capote", it's in 3 scenes, one he is driving. Capote was filmed partially in Winnipeg Canada.

On other thing the carter ball and ball carb on the models with semi-auto are different, they do have a dash pot and kick-down switch for the M6 Trans, so if is the current set-up, I would just have the carb re-built or replaced and go with that, if it's a fluid drive and 3 sp standard trans, fill your boots and put on 3 carbs or even a 2 bbl set-up and split-exhaust manifold.

Hope this helps, and I think nothing is wrong going in either direction, one group would have us all on a straight pepper diet and one would offer no flavor for our fare, its's whatever we want our ride to be and what we want to do to it to make it that way...............Fred