Ignition 37 zephyr

Hello All.

I managed to get the cracked windows including the screen out, and new ones are now being cut, front bumper and some other parts are going for re-chroming this week,(no doubt that will cost an arm and a leg).

I thought I would check the ignition wiring out, and was curious to see what the resistors looked like, when I stripped the tinwork away I could see it mounted on the back of the firewall, with a relay? (what does this do).

On closer examination, both of the coils were being supplied from one resistor, presumably at only half there normal supply. so I stripped it all down, cleaned it and assembled it correctly, I checked the voltage, it was 2.8v and 3v, but the battery was not fully charged. I started the car up, and it ran much better, it was still a bit erratic on tickover, but as soon as you touch the throttle pedal, the engine picks up straight away, with no missing, so I am going to leave it until I can get it out on the road for a test drive,I have got a couple of new condesers coming from someone on this forum,(many thanks Jack) which I will fit anyway, the fine tuning may only be carburation, having said that, I hav'nt even done a compression test on it yet, may do that this weekend.

The wiring is in a shocking state (excuse the pun), the coverings are totaly rotten, with bits dropping off if you touch them.

I must make up a new loom, I have another loom to do, for a 53 Ford E83 box van, which my son is restoring, so may do the two together.

I don't know if the third brush has been done away with in the dynamo, as I hav'nt had it open yet, but the car is fitted with a common 6v Lucas dynamo regulator, hidden beside the resistors, I don't know how this will affect the wiring job, it might end up as a mix of both types.

Regards

Peter Smith

Dear Peter,I enjoy your updates,we have all been there,keep em coming.diz

Hey Peter, keep in mind that there is supossed to be 2 resistors, one for each terminal on the coil, which is actually 2 coils in one. The common source wire from the ignition switch goes to each resistor, then each resisted wire moves on to it's respective coil terminal, so adding another resistor may improve the running even more. The tin box in the area where the resistors are is a circuit breaker, that will disconnect the electricity flow throughout the car when it get's hot, as it cools off, it will re-set but if the problem has not been solved, it will get hot and disconnect again, and eventually fail. Over here, we call Lucas, "The Prince Of Darkness", as anyone with a British Car has faced staggering problems with the Lucas components. I and others still heartily recommend Jake Fleming as the ultimate cure for all ignition problems, probally difficult to get the unit to Dallas Texas, but as others have found, doing a prewar car in Europe is a challenge and a half, you are to be commended for your perseverance, good luck

The reason the British drink warm beer is that they all have Lucas refigerators.

Bill

The circuit breaker in the box next to the resistors controls the headlights mostly.

Bill

Hello Bill

I worked for an english Brewery for 27 years, Brewing that very stuff, warm beer, (Newcastle brown ale), Judging by the amount that is now being exported to the US, you guys must have a taste for it too.

Be carefull, it's a plot by Lucas, when they get you drunk enough, the Lucas sales reps will descend on you.

Just looked at the dynamo today, and the third brush has been removed, so it's a standard setup, (looks in good condition too).

Had a look at the wiper wheel boxes as well, they look very delicate, when compared to todays monsters, how did they get the spindle in, was it cast into the housing, when it was manufactured?

Regards

Peter Smith

Hello 41Z

Yes when I saw the resistor, the Feed wire was going to the centre, which fed both resistors,(correct I assumed), but both wires to the coils were coming from the end of one resistor, and nothing from the other, so I thought the coils would only be getting half the current required, resulting in the poor spark, things were much improved, after cleaning and connecting up properly, one coil to the end of each resistor.

In my first post, I mentioned the 39 LZ that my brother wrecked, the only relic I have from that car is the heater, I don't know how it has survived house moves etc for 40 odd years, but it has, I though of fitting it to mine, where are the normal feed and return points taken from on the engine, I noticed a blanking plug in the head (cast iron heads), next to the oil filter, but could not see anything for a return,

Regards

Peter Smith

Peter, The feeds for the hot water heater are through the left head where you found the plug and the left water pump. I believe the water pumps on the pre war V 12 are slightly different than the post war which I am more familiar so may not have a plug or nipple for a heater hose. I believe that the primary heater for pre war cars was a hot air heater from a heater box on the exhaust. The plug on the head was replaced with a shutoff valve with nipple to start and stop the flow of hot water.

It sounds as though you are conquering the mysteries of the V 12 quite well.

Bill

Peter, Do your cast iron heads have a pre-fix of 26H cast in front of the part number or an other pre-fix such as H or 86H-? I seem to recall that export Lincolns were equiped with cast iron heads instead of the aluminium heads fitted to the domestic models up to 1941.

By the term wiper wheel box do you mean the wiper towers that mount just in front of the windshield (screen)? If you do than the removal of the shaft is not all that difficult. Lock the shaft in a vice and using a block of wood as a cushin, tap the housing off of the shaft with an 8 ounce hammer. The shaft is serrated and pressed into a wheel that has chains or links attached that transmit the motion of the wiper motor arms to the wipers. The cowards way of removing the shaft is to drill a 1/8 hole in the back of the housing and use a drift punch to drive out the shaft. The hole can be filled by your chrome plater or just put some dumdum in the hole to seal it.

Bill

Hey Bill -

You are correct; the pre-war waterpumps did not have the plug to accommodate the hot water heater. See toward the bottom of the following page to see the main differences between early and later pumps.

http://www.mindspring.com/~bozarth/id8.html

Cecil, as you surmised the hole in the clutch area of the crankpan is to allow oil to leak out. The cotter pin is mounted loose so as to turn with the vibrations of the running engine and road shocks of the moving car and thus it self cleans itself of dirt and sludge and stays open.

On the intake manifold the hole that is absent is for the tube that goes to the air cleaner and sucks fumes from the valve chamber of the engine. It was probably the first PCV systems in the auto industry. Did this first start in 38?

Bill

Hello Bill.

Yes the right hand head has 26H-6049 on it, but I can't find any plug on the left hand water pump, I suppose I could always tap into the bottom hose.

I was pleased that the heads were cast iron on this car, as I have a bit of a pet hate for aluminium heads, I should imagine that they would have been in a bit of a state by now if they had been aluminium.

Re your reply to Cecil, regarding crankcase breather, on this engine, there is a 5/8" ish pipe stub coming off high up on the oil filler pipe at right angles, I thought this was some sort of breather, but it is not connected to anything, there is nothing for it to connect to on the air cleaner, all I can see is, on the heat insulator between the carb and the manifold, which is about 1/2" thick, are two 3/8"ish pipes coming out of the front, but these have been blanked off with a couple of screws, can't see anywhere that they can connect to, but you never know what missmatch of later or earlier parts may have been used during the cars life.

Regards

Peter Smith

Peter -

That stub on the oil filler tube led to a road draft tube, which came out a couple of inches, then went down the passenger side of the engine. The road draft tube was held in place by a bracket that bolted to the head.

You can see it in the pics here: http://www.mindspring.com/~bozarth/id4.html

This type of engine ventilation system was used in '36-'38 (the only difference is that it switched sides in '38 to make room for the battery).

Hello Cecil

That is a lovely looking engine in the photo, I wish mine looked like that, I see where the draft tube goes now, I should be able to manufacture one OK, I will also have to look out for the correct oil filler cap, as mine has a temporary plastic one stuck in at the moment.

I did not get any keys at all with this car, I would at least like be able to lock the door, I am not too bothered about the steering lock. are blanks still available, If I dismantle the lock barrel, I should be able to file the correct blank to fit, ( were the steering lock and door key the same??? or two separate keys)

Regards

Peter Smith

Peter, Door lock and ignition are the same and trunk and glove box are the same. There is a key code stamped into the lock barrels and there is a company in Ohio I think the name is Jesser or Jessep who will make the keys as per the lock code. They advertise in Hemmings and in The Way of the Zephyr. They are a little pricy, but it is nice to have keys.If the locks have not been changed remove door locks and glove box locks to read the key code.

Bill