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10W tractor fluid


bebop138

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I've seen that fluid at Fleet Farm, and don't think it's the stuff. I think your best shot would be a hydraulics place that caters to lift trucks and such. That's where I'm going to look next. It's really hydraulic fluid, just happens that it's also used in "hydrostatic" tractor drives, thus called "tractor fluid." Let me know if you find it. Also, it might be listed in the Parts forum on "P15-D24" web site.

My buddy finally got his '47 D24 sedan out under its own power last weekend. We've been working on it since last Spring. He was slipping the clutch and fooling around to keep it going. I asked him if he'd checked the fluid in the coupling and was aghast when he said "no!" Ouch. I'm going to insist on that before any more driving.

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Guest imported_BaronvonR

The NAPA that I deal with here in Conn. carries cases of the 10W non-detergent, so I buy it there. As you all know this is what I run in my Imperial and my De Soto. Drove the De Soto to Canada this year and it ran beautifully...no problems and 18.2 mpg.

NOW...if you cant find the 10W I found that a company called XCEL out of Tampa Fla., produces a hydraulic oil that is 10W under another name. It says AW/R&O Hydraulic oil MEDIUM. It sells for $9.95/gallon. Part number 04627. Web address is www.xcellube.com. Email is info@xcellube.com.

Hope this helps.

BvR

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Guest leadsled1953

i get 10wt non detergent down in NJ at the napa.its castrol so its a good grade.i called one company[sorry forgot the name]and asked about thier 10wt nd.the guy asked me what i was using for and i told him it was for the fluid drive.he told me NOT to use their oil because it was a low grade oil.so check out the oil before you put it in your car.

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Thanks for the tip, Baron. I am in the market now that a mere pint or two has been drained from the old D24 coupling. It looked TERRIBLE, smelled like old tranny fluid and I'm afraid the seals might be toast. I'm planning to get enough oil to fill it twice, once to flush and a second time to try it. Or is there another recommended flushing procedure? I suppose running some trans fluid through it might wash it out better because of the detergents, then fill with the right stuff. Any thoughts?

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Guest imported_BaronvonR

Thats how I flushed out my 2 cars....thoroughly drained em, filled with tranny fluid, drove around for a few minutes and redrained, then filled with the 10W. The seals on my De Soto were toast and the oil ran out almost as fast as I put it in ....so the hunt was on to find replacements...it took a while and while I had the whole unit out along with the tranny I replaced the clutch disc as well. I only wanted to do it once:)

If you need part numbers on the seals I have em.

BvR

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Does the torque converter on the fluid drive have seals? When I drained the converter I only filled the oil drain pan about half way. The manual said it takes 13 1/2 quarts to fill it?? No way it drained that much--so either I am leaking or????? Does the tractor fluid have to be non-detergent?? I have been messing with getting this ole Windsor going so I am hoping there is nothing wrong with the torque converter. Can you start the engine without any fluid in the converter, if you don`t drive it? That way I can see if it runs. Thanks

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Guest imported_BaronvonR

Perhaps the oil leaked out over time, this is what happened to my De Soto. There was very little fluid in the unit, and while I was able to drive the car it felt as if the clutch was slipping badly. Once i filled the unit (although it was not full long) the car fairly flew!!! Then the oil leaked out again. You cannot drive the car without the fluid in there, but should be OK to just start the car, in neutral. I would not do this for long though. The better idea is to fill the converter to the top, then start the car. Unless you have a severe leak, you should be able to drive it for a short distance safely and you will then be able to determine if the seals are leaking and how badly.

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52er,

I don't believe the fluid drive requires that much fluid. The shop manual for the '47 stubbornly refuses to give the capacity--maybe they never knew for sure! To fill it properly you do just like a differential or tranny, fill 'til it gets to the hole and starts to run out. I THINK it's about 3 quarts, but we'll find out, won't we? The hole should be lined up with the access plate at about the 2 o'clock position. I believe this fills the coupling up past the "halfway" point, so the seal which is in the middle will be covered. Makes sense because seals usually aren't made to sit "dry." The '47 had only about a pint of cruddy tranny oil in it when drained, but the car still moved! It's getting the "treatment" to flush it out. As Baron has mentioned, flushing with transmission fluid (Type F seems best bet because it doesn't have "seal softener" additives) is a good cleaner. Then drain and fill again with the tractor fluid.

The fluid coupling is NOT really a "converter" unless the '52 is different--there's no torque multiplication in the coupling. It DOES definitely have a seal on the shaft, called a "bellows" seal in the manual. If this seal goes out, of course it will leak while driving, and even while sitting if it's filled enough to cover the seal. Unfortunately, I don't think there's much hope for the seal if the unit is low. The fluid went SOMEWHERE, right? And sitting with just a little fluid in it would result in a dried out seal as well, I think. I'm figuring if it just doesn't leak too BAD, I'll be happy for a while, but eventually will have to replace the seal. Have to pull the transmission to do that.

Not looking foward to it. I bet the transmission with coupling is a heavy sucker.

Anyone care to comment on putting in a seal? Or on my theorizing in this post? It's all just theory 'til you do it! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

BTW, the drain/fill plug I took out had a home-made "gasket" on it. Somebody apparently thought they were losing all that fluid through the plug hole and tried a quick fix. Not likely it helped any... I believe there are two plugs in the coupling and I suppose the other one still has a "gasket." I'm just going to throw those away because a gasket on a plug is probably more likely to cause leaks than to fix them.

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Guest imported_BaronvonR

It was dropping the drive shaft, removing the transmission and then the fluid unit....drained it will be lighter. I had to maker certain tools to be able to remove some of the parts, but it basically went "by the book". Time wise I guess that depends on how fast you are...it took me days, mostly because I was waiting on the parts.....

BvR

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Thanks Baron... the D24 was puttering around the yard again today, much better with some fluid in the drive! It did not seem to have noticeable leakage--yet. Maybe we'll sneak by with this one. I understand your post to say the hardest part is getting TO the seal, and the replacement is pretty straightforward then. I really wasn't in the mood to tackle all those old drivetrain bolts just yet. As for speed, depends a lot on weather and mood! I'm more of a "wrench-bender" than a mechanic. Pretty good with a wrench, not always so hot at diagnosing and doing the tech-type work.

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Guest imported_BaronvonR

The difficulty was in finding the parts...came from all over the country..I used partsvoice to locate them.

As far as the tool, I had to jerryrig some to get some of the parts apart...the book calls for specific ones, and I improvised. Installation was easy once I had the pieces. I do recommend that you replace your clutch disc as well...mine looked OK, but figured new and fresh was better:)

OK here are the names and part numbers for the seal..it has 7 parts to it:

1117137 Seal, with nose

1061168 Ring

854011 Gasket

1112754 Damper

854362 Spring

1117139 Retainer

854401 Snap ring

864054 Clutch plate...may be different for the Chrysler 6 but this is what is right for the De Soto 6.

Hope this helps ya

BvR

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Thanks Baron for the part numbers---I put in the tractor fluid today and it only took about 7 quarts, just have to wait and see if it leaks--waiting on the oil filters to get here and she`s ready to fire. Always waiting on the little stuff!! Later with report on the first start-up in 10 years!!! Thanks again....

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Say, thanks for the info and part nos. I DROVE the D24 yesterday. What a thrill! Slow in the driveway, and there was quite a bit of slippage due to the fluid drive not being full, but so far no leaks anywhere. Had it idling in gear for several minutes in the driveway to check for leaks from the fluid drive and elsewhere. It has an "interim" fill of Type F tranny fluid, and for some reason my buddy only put in about 3 quarters. I can't wait to see how it does with a full drive. Also, timed it to TDC and other than a little "stutter" in the idle--probably from sticky valves--it runs like a champ! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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Guest imported_BaronvonR

Congratz Both of You!!!!

Just goes to show you that you cant kill these old MoPars, and the more you see that the more you love em!!

BvR

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Thanks, Baron. Really appreciate the acknowledgement! I rode along for a trip around the field today. Much improved performance with a fresh load of fluid! Used Valvoline Universal Tractor Fluid (hydraulic fluid) from NAPA. 10 bucks a gallon. The final final on the capacity, and I believe it was completely empty when starting the fill, was the same as 52er's experience: a little less than 7 quarts. It does not seem to have any significant leaks driving. We'll see how the level stays while it sits with the seal covered in fluid. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

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So far it seems my seal is holding, I turned it over a few times so the seal would get covered--hope for the best. Just trying to get it running so it can move under it own power enough to up and down the driveway. The brakes are shot but I cleaned them up enough that it does pump the pedal up. Having it hauled to my buddys place so I can get the floors patched up and body mounts repaired, so I need enough power and brake to move it around in his garage. When we get that done I can get her home before it gets to cold and finish the rear end change and do the interior and have it done by spring---YAAAAYYYYYY. Still let you know when it gets fired up!!! This next week should be it.

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52er,

Can't wait to hear all about the "maiden voyage!" <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> Who needs floor boards? It's really easy to get to the master cylinder on the D24 with a big hole in the driver's side! Motor mounts are a different story, they need to be solid for sure.

As for the brakes, you can just get the fronts working and seal off the rear line at the master cylinder as it has two separate lines--at least if your setup is similar to the D24. Not good for the road, but it holds fine for little driveway cruises. Most of the braking is on the front, anyway.

Regarding your fluid drive, when it's full the fluid is over center so I believe the seal is sitting in fluid even when the coupling is stationary. Hope you luck out on leaks like we did (so far). Hey, we're still kind of "on topic" for this thread! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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  • 1 month later...
Guest imported_billmeyer

There sure have been a lot of discussions over the years about what fluid to use in the fluid drive unit. Back when we were working on my 50 Wayfarer in 2003, several in the forum said that Dexron tranny fluid could be used. Our unit had not been on the car for years (the engine and drivetrain came in pieces but the fluid drive unit was intact. We filled it with 7 quarts of Dexron and hoped for the best. Amazingly, the unit did not leak! The car is now my (occasional) daily driver and I've put over 1,000 miles on it during the past year. Still haven't added a drop of fluid and it works like new! The tranny was another story (std 3 speed). It leaked like a sieve! I ordered new gaskets and seals, as well as front and rear bearings, from Andy Bernbaum and had them professionally installed by an old-time mechanic familiar with these units. Still leaks a few drops but nothing to be of concern.

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  • 2 months later...

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