Harmonic Balancer

Maybe mine was a "freak", but has anyone else had a problem with the harmonic balancer separating (the outer ring separating from the inner)?<P>My 89 starting having starting problem - and within 2 days wouldn't start at all. The dealer diagnosed the harmonic balancer, but also found the crank sensor and electonic module gone (he suspects that they may have "shorted" and burnt their circuits when the harmonic came apart). Needless to say an expensive repair ($1500 Canadian).<BR>

Separation of the harmonic balancer may not be a common occurrence but it could happen to most any vehicle. The inner and outer halves of the balancer are bonded together with rubber. This can deteriorate over time, just like tires or weather stripping. <BR>Parts for the 3800 are not hard to find (new or used). The ECM for the Reatta is the same one used in the Rivera, Toronado and many Cadillac?s so it should be fairly easy to find a used one for under $100. I am a die hard "do it your selfer" and I feel this is a relative easy repair. You may be able to do it yourself and save a lot of money.<BR>Good Luck! <BR>

Hi,<BR> my 1991 Riviera with just 130 K miles has had this problem, and my advise is get a new Harmonic Balancer, dealer cost is around $100U.S plus the installation, I wouldn't trust a used one, as I have already gone that route, and only know too well.<BR>Yes , they do seperate, and don't really know why some models suffer more than the others.<P>Good luck!<P>Prakash

FYI - the rubber in the harmonic balancer is just like the rest of the rubber under the hood & on suspension parts - over time it deteriorates. The process is excellerated in really hot climates, but not too unusal in colder ones.<BR>If the H/M rubber came apart - you might want to start looking at other things like belts/hoses/motor mounts/suspension m ounts, etc. If one goes, the rest are typically soon to follow ... coming from years of experience.<BR>~Brenda<P>------------------<BR> <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html" TARGET=_blank>http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html</A>

I've been a very active auto mechanical enthusiast for over 30 years and I've only seen that happen twice, on a Ford and a Plymouth.<BR>Orono's recommendations are sound.

Hi Rick - not sure if you've tried removing the harmonic balancer yourself, but I have. On my 1990 (now with 176K on it) the rubber in the harmonic balancer deteriorated & seperated (though it didn't do any other damage at the time) to the extent that ~1/2 the rubber was gone when it made the final seperation. Naturally, I crawled under the car myself to do the repair work & found that the factory H/B was not designer to be removed with a standard (3-screw-type) steering wheel puller ... ended up havingg the dealer do it.<P>------------------<BR> <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html" TARGET=_blank>http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html</A>

Yesterday morning my 90 made a loud knocking or rattling noise so after work I worked on it and found that my Harmonic balancer had separated, after a couple hours I got the old one off, it really wasn't too hard to get off with a little prying and pulling. Is this a dealer item or would a parts store carry them? I haven't too much luck with my local Buick dealer when it comes to finding other items.

Quite frankly, your Buick dealer shouldn't have a tough time finding you parts - that's their job. However, it may be a more pleasant experience to deal with Courtesy Chevrolet out of Phoenix, AZ. Their # is 1-800-528-6021, just ask for Don in parts & tell him I sent you. If you've got a credit card, they'll ship the part(s) out to you.<P>~Brenda<P>------------------<BR> <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html" TARGET=_blank>http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html</A>

What a timely post! I just had mine ('90 - 115,000) replaced. There was a very loud clicking noise at idle. When the rpms went up, the sound disappeared. I have the service manual and could have definitely done the repair myself if I wanted to spend a day doing it myself and buy the special tools needed. It was worth it for me to have the dealer do it -- about $400 parts and labor.

Perhaps the crank sensor going bad was a coincidence when the rubber let go. The interupter teeth for the crank sensor are attached to the solid center of the damper assembly and should not have caused a problem. If this were not the case, the timing would vary as the damper flexes. There should not be any special tools required to change the damper, as it is not an interference fit like some engines. The hardest part is getting the center bolt loose, and tight again, as it requires a couple of hundred lbs/ft. of torque. Mine also has a small shock absorber located directly in front of the damper which must be removed as well. If you can get the center bolt out, the damper itself should pull straight off, no puller is needed. <P>------------------<BR>Hal, btk@vbe.com

<BR> Harmonic Dampers fail all the time. A lot of early Ford engines were ruined when the outer ring slipped only a few degrees. The timing marks are on the outside ring. So when the engine went in for a "tune up", the timing would be set wrong.<P> My favorite Harmonic Balancer saga occured when I had my turbocharged Corvair Corsa. On these engines the oil filter was right next to the Balancer. When the outer ring came completely free, it spun a groove in the filter can. I probably fogged the mosquitoes in three counties before I coasted off the Interstate.

Bob's absolutly right, as a corvair collector, I know that failed harmonic balancers are quite common, with the added problem that when they fail, they saw into the oil filter. The corvair community has a fellow that rebuilds these with new elastomer

I've been reading these responses with great interest especially Hal's post about being able to remove the Harmonic Balancer on a 3800 without a puller. On other engines I've damaged Balancers before by pulling one from the outer ring and even melted the rubber on another when I tried to metal-spray and re-machine the oil seal surface but, in my experiences I wouldn't say that it is COMMON for one to spin apart on it's own. The only torque on the outer ring is centrifugal! My experience with Corvairs is limited to a few (loved that Spider) but, I think it would be a good bet to say that balancers that spin apart during operation were probably damaged during removal/installation.<BR>JJ, if Hal's post is accurate, I would definitely do the work myself.

The pulling of the damper without a puller is accurate. I just finished a higher compression 3800 for my Reatta and it is not a press fit like other engines, which means you don't need an installation tool either.<P>------------------<BR>Hal, btk@vbe.com