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About GLong

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  • Birthday 12/07/1952
  1. Hi Guys. are the valve spring unique in some dimension or pressure or ?? I've contacted a few spring companies with issues regarding valve springs, and found a few very helpful people who knew how to navigate their databases, and found a modern spring that fit the parameters I needed. The extra long springs used in many of the old engines do usually require having some made to order, but the shorter springs usually can be found in some form or another, being used or recently used in more modern engines.. Just a thought.. Greg L
  2. Hello Brian, I'm the Pierce Arrow guy from Holly, you came to an old car event at my place a few years ago. I've done the same operation with modern valves on several engines.. I look for a modern SS valve, with the valve stem enough larger that the wear in the original valve guide can be reamed out and honed to size. I don't like putting the stress of pressing out and pressing in new valve guides in old iron cylinder blocks. If an inconell exhaust valve can be found, the valve will outlast the car and engine. What Caterpillar valve did you find to use? .402 is an odd size, most common is .375" which is 3/8", next up is 7/16" which is .437".. So that .402 stem is somewhere around 10.5mm. Some late teens engines used a valve with that stem diameter too. The valve length is pretty long: 7.5" long, with a 1-5/8" head diameter. Where did you find you could purchase the Diesel valves? Glad you 'only' have the reassembly of the engine to do now. Good warm weather for driving an open car is still a month or two away.. Take care, Greg Long
  3. Do you have a Marvel Mystery oil dispenser on the engine intake manifold? or a similar upper cylinder lubrication device? If so, could it be leaking, pooling on the throttle butterfly, then leaking out the throttle shaft clearances ? The only 'red' substances that are oily, are ATF, Marvel Mystery Oil, liquified red grease, dried or partially dried gasoline, I'm sure there are dozens more I can't think of. GLong
  4. If you heard air leakage when performing the compression test, it is most likely valves not sealing. Just because the valves are going up and down, does not have anything to do with how well the valve seats make clean, tight contact and seal the combustion chamber. Any time the head is off one of our old cars, it is a good idea to clean the valves, and lap the valve to the valve seat and inspect the results. The lapping will turn the seat a silvery-gray. Any black specs or spots are pits in the sealing surface. If the pits are grouped closely in an area, that part of the valve is not sealing well. If there is an area where there is NO contact, with the lapping process, that valve is not sealing much if any. Sometimes just a bunch of carbon chunks get caught under the valve, and hold it off the seat. This can easily be remedied when the head is off and if the valves are cleaned and lapped. If the rings are really bad, you will see a carbon-free ring around the outer edge of the piston, where the oil is coming past the rings, and 'washing' off the carbon. You can, like you mentioned, push a piston around in a cylinder bore and often see the top piston ring.. So find the gap in the top ring you can see. Is the gap in the ring greater than say .030"? That's just about the same as the spark plug gap. if the ring gap is wider than .025-.030", then the rings are pretty worn. If it were my engine, from your description, I'd clean and lap the valves, I'm pretty sure you will find some poor valve seats, or carbon stuck in the seats, stopping the valve from sealing. A rebuild with boring the block, new pistons and rings, new valves and valve guides, rebabbited mains and rods, with mains line bored, and the crank and cam reground, cam followers refaced, cam bearings replaced or ? Timing chain ? if it has one, replace it if worn, You are looking at $15,000-$20,000 or possibly more, depends on a LOT of wear factors, condition of heads and cylinder blocks, etc. Hope this helps. GLong
  5. Yep, where did that 4 1/2 quarts of oil go, while it was on the flatbed? Was the car sitting level when YOU checked the oil level? I believe an inspection of the engine is in order, take it to someone who will drop the oil pan, and inspect each connecting rod for scores, excess oil clearance and obvious wear. While you have owned and driven the car, have you changed the oil? Did you notice any change in indicated oil pressure while driving in the Pocono's ? If the oil was that low, and the engine starved for oil enough that it burnt up a connecting rod bearing or two, then you should have seen significantly low oil pressure, and possibly even elevated engine coolant temperatures. Did you note any low pressure indications ?? GLong
  6. Solid copper wire spark plug wires have the lowest resistance and therefore the lowest spark voltage of any spark plug cable. In a '20's or '30's vintage car, most engines have a spark plug wire loom or tube that all the wires are routed through, and exit at each cylinder's spark plug. If a '20's or '30's car has carbon core wires installed, and feeds them [read: pushes and pulls them] through the plug wire loom, they will not only most likely sustain damage to the center core of the wires, as they are fragile.. But when high voltage wires are jammed together in a tube, spark voltage will find the path of least resistance. And with carbon core wires, that likely will be to the wiring tube, or other plug wires. If looked at on an ignition oscilloscope, a carbon core wire if broken internally, will show a much higher voltage than a good wire, and any carbon core wire will have higher spark voltage than a copper core wire.. For a '50's car, with plug wires separated by a 'rooster comb' then the cross-firing is not likely a problem, but I'd never use anything but copper core wire on a '20's car with a wiring loom. As for the electronic ignition, like most of the above posts ask.. WHY? I have a '33 Pierce Arrow 836, I've driven it 500-1000 miles every summer since 2000, and the dual points and condenser system has never changed it's settings or let me down.. AND, if it did let me down, I can get it running with minimal tools and time. GLong
  7. I agree with Rusty, I think they are both early marine engines. I'm pretty sure I've seen a similar if not the same 2cyl one in a wood boat years ago. GLong
  8. As mentioned above: ATF, automatic transmission fluid has lubricity, and is very high detergent. And it is reasonably priced for an automotive lubricant. Many modern standard-shift transmissions use ATF instead of 90wt gear oil. Looking at the photo of the exposed main shaft of the trans, it looks very clean. I'd look with a flashlight into the bottom of the transmission case, and see if there is a lot of crud deposited there. The straight gear transmissions did not generate a lot of crud, since there is nothing wearing away, unlike in an automatic transmission. You might find very little on the bottom of the transmission case. GLong
  9. There is nothing better than the Neway cutters for working on a flat head engine in the car. If a car has in-head valves, then I'd still prefer to do them my self, because some machine shops have no respect for old parts that are irreplaceable. For work on an engine in the car, nothing is worse than all that grinding-wheel grit getting everywhere in, on and around the engine. With the hand-cutters by Neway, the steel/iron shavings stay right next to the seat, and can be vacuumed up. I usually put a vacuum hose in the port of the valve seat I'm cutting, this sucks up all the metal filings as they are created. The engine deck stays clean. You never have to reface stones for wear or to correct the angle, and deal with the mess of more grinding grit everywhere. Ebay often has a few kits up for auction, but you need to educate yourself about the Neway products. There is a '100-series' and a '200-series' set of pilots, cutters and operating handles. I use the '200-series'. they have larger pilots to fit the big valve stem sizes of the old cars. The '100-series' is best for the imports, lawnmowers, motorcycles etc. GLong
  10. Check the insulation for the point/condenser bolt that passes through he side of the distributor. Make sure the rubber or bakelite insulation block is clean and there is no chance it is shorting to the distributor. consider trying a third new condenser. If you are using a NOS one, they can 'sort-of' work, show a spark at the plugs but the engine won't start. This is an odd one, but put a jumper wire on the distributor body, and then to the body, or the engine block to assure a perfect ground for the distributor. Check that the condenser is tight, making a good ground to the point plate in the distributor. Look VERY closely at the rotor, and cap. use a magnifying glass. I've had a rotor develop an internal carbon track, it was found by looking in the recess where it sits on the distributor shaft.. just a tiny black spot that should not be there. Make sure your distributor cam has some lubrication on it. if it was or is dry, make sure the points have some gap, to have it exact at this time is not crucial, but the points must be opening at least .016-.020". And make sure there is no oil or a finger print on the points' surface. I've had terrible luck with 'C' spark plugs. If they get flooded once, they often are then junk, good for lining trash cans. I do not know why, other than the porcelain in the insulator seems to get a coating that shorts the plug. I know many people have no problems with them.. but try a previous 'used' set of plugs. Just sandblasting won't remove the 'plastic-like' coating that gets on the plugs when they are flooded. Look at the chronology of when the car would not start. Did you just buy a fresh tank of fuel? Did you do ANY carb, fuel pump, distributor work or make adjustments ? It cannot be driven into the garage and go out of time or become 180* off when it's sitting there. Just think back on when it ran last and then later when it would not start. Why did it flood? Operator error [ too much choke too long] ? That's what I sometimes do, I forget the particular way a car likes to be started. Then I flood it.. I've also found water in the float bowl of a carburetor, just a coincidence that it was running ok, when parked but would not start or run properly, and it needed the float bowl cleaned out, and the fuel tank sump drained.. Have you looked at or changed the fuel filter?? I know it's flooding, but maybe if you have a hidden see-through filter it might offer some clue, like a bunch of rust? or water ? When you do find the culprit please post it here, so we all can learn from your experience here. I hope you get your 120 on the road again soon. GLong
  11. Lets 'get real' here: A Pierce Model 43 is not a 'low-level' Pierce Arrow. It is not 'low', or 'lower' or 'lesser' in any way. It cost a few hundred dollars less than a model 41/42. Mostly because of the smaller bodies on the shorter wheelbase. All the Pierce Arrow cars, and I mean ALL were built to a standard of quality, not to a price. And this is why Pierce eventually went bankrupt: they could not compete against cars built to a price standard, for Pierce, quality and advanced engineering were the law. If a person who has never been in each of the models of a car wants to KNOW, not guess, about the cars, then go to a Pierce Arrow regional or national meet, and look them over, ask the owners about them, most of us will gladly give a ride in our cars. And if the person indicates they know how to drive a car from the late '20's through mid 30's I will usually let someone drive one of my cars. The so-called 'small' 8 from Pierce is 366 cubic inches, that's NOT small, the 'small' Packard Standard-8 was 320 cuin. The Pierce and Packard big 8's were both 385 cubic inches, The Packard was rated for fewer horsepower. The model 43, with 134 and 137" wheelbase was fit with the smaller bodies, like the convertible coupe, or fixed top coupe, or Club Brougham [2-door/5 passenger]coach or the standard 5 passenger 4-door sedan. The bigger 385 cu. inch engine was used in the longer wheelbase cars because they NEEDED the bigger engine, those were 142 and 147 inch wheelbase cars. That is the only difference between the models, the wheelbase length and the size of the body that wheelbase would accommodate. The fit and finish were identical, the wheels, tires, brakes, front and rear axles, gas tank, headlights and tail lights, radiator shell all identical. Tire size sometimes was upgraded for weight-carrying capacity. There were some differences in doors on the hood, and some bits of chrome trim. The ONLY time there was a possible difference in fit and finish was if the car had a body by a custom coachmaker. And it is difficult when put side by side to find fault with the 'factory' Pierce coachwork, it was after all, all hand made and assembled. The 366 'small' 8 is built to the same identical standards as the 385. It does not have a cast crank, they were all forged crankshafts, the difference is that the 366 crank has bolt on counterweights while the 385 crank has integral counterweights. None of the Pierce engines have any issues in design. The lubrication systems are the same, the intake and exhaust manifolds are the same, the distributor may use a different cap and rotor.. it's still a Delco distributor. In fact, without looking at the engine serial number the engines are identical. If a rebuilder wants to, he can put the 1/4" longer stroke 385 crankshaft in a 366 block, since they are the same casting, use shorter pistons, and turn a 366 into a 385. The factory ratings were 125hp for the 366, and 132hp for the 385 in 1931. So a 7 hp increase for the 19 cubic inch increase in engine displacement. If all three 1931 models were lined up side by side and looked over, the differences are the wheelbase, and available body styles. You will be hard-pressed to tell the differences without an intimate knowledge regarding the model year. Only in 1930 did Pierce attempt to make a slightly 'lesser' car for their lineup. The Model C had an inch shorter wheelbase than the Model B's. The 'C' engine was 340 cubic inches, and a single throat updraft carb was used, it was 'merely' 115 hp vs the 366 engine in the Model B which made 125 hp. That 'experiment' was for one year only. But again, put the cars on the show field next to each other, and compare, the quality is the same, and without knowing the small differences, it is hard to tell them apart. Mid priced cars are just that, a Pierce Arrow is a very high quality hand built car. Greatly overbuilt and under stressed. The is a reason that Seagraves bought the rights and tooling for the 8 and V12 engines and that the engines were still available 30+ years later in the late '60s as a gasoline powerplants in the Seagraves firetrucks. Minor changes like two spark plugs per cylinder and insert rod bearings. How many engine designs lasted 40 years and the last 30 were for industrial and emergency vehicle applications? Are the Pierce Arrow cars heavy ? yes, Would I want to drive in city traffic in a big enclosed Pierce ? Not usually. I like my Pierces out on the open road, not playing parking-lot roulette. Just setting the record straight, GLong
  12. Yes, it probably is Panasote, there are several versions, I'd contact the suppliers with photos of your top material. GLong
  13. K8096: if your Packard has not had the carb off in 50 years, I'll recommend that you remove it and clean it thoroughly. That's a lot of years of gas drying out in the carb when stored, a lot of very small bits of crud getting through the filter and settling into the bottom of the float bowl.. If the accelerator pump is working correctly, then you only need to buy a gasket set for the carb. It is likely that at least one paper gasket will get torn when opening up the carb. On the EE carburetors, the bottom of the float bowl is about 3/8"-1/2" lower than the passageway that lets fuel into the main jets. What happens is this lower 'floor' acts like a sediment bowl, collecting bits of crud over the years. I've removed an amazing amount of stuff from an EE float bowl. You can do this clean out in the car, but it can be difficult to lean over the fender and sidemount spare. If it's an EE3 in a prewar Packard, it's a V12, isn't it ? That one is harder to clean on the car. If your fuel level in the gas tank is fairlly low, you can add Seafoam or similar products to the fuel. And it might be high enough of a concentration to be effective. I'd not waste the money on adding the cleaner to a full tank, the concentration is just too low to be effective. just my opinion. Where are you located ?? GLong
  14. If your carburetor design has a vent tube in the intake throat, I'd use a syringe or possibly a small funnel and add a concentrated dose of SeaFoam or similar carb/fuel system cleaner to the float bowl, let it sit overnight, and run it some more, repeat a few times. Often this will clean out the smaller jet orifices. Since you said the car is running pretty good, I'd say you got very lucky, and the car sat with ethanol-free gasoline in it. If your carburetor [probably a Stromberg EE-22 or 23 ? ] does not have an air vent pipe in the inlet of the carb, just above the choke plate, then you might have to be a bit more creative, maybe remove the fuel line at the inlet of the carb and install a temporary fuel line and gravity feed some SeaFoam or other cleaner to the float bowl. IF YOU CHOOSE TO REMOVE THE FUEL LINE BE CAREFUL !! The float bowl is POTMETAL and will break easily !! One other possible 'fix' would be to remove the idle mixture screws and using an aerosol can of carb-cleaner, spray generously through the jet, replace the mixture screw to it's previous setting. [before removing the mixture screw, gently turn the screw in until it bottoms, counting the # of turns to allow you to return it to this setting when reinstalled] Start and run the car, it will run like it's flooded until the carb-cleaner is drawn into the engine and burnt. Then repeat this on the other idle mixture screw. Of course the obvious 'cure' is to remove the carb and thoroughly clean it, replace gaskets etc. But sometimes the in-fuel cleaners will do the job. Interesting story [to me at least] I bought a 1933 Pierce Arrow 836, Club Sedan that had sat with 'reformulated' gasoline in it for over 10 years, the fuel in the tank had evaporated down to a 2" deep layer of goo, much like permatex #2 gasket goop. The fuel pump would pump, and the carb was not completely clogged. Once I got the fuel tank cleaned, pump rebuilt, and the carb thoroughly cleaned, etc the car ran very well, with one exception: The inboard idle mixture screw was not anywhere near as sensitive to adjustment as the outboard mixture screw. The inboard was still partially clogged. What I mean is that at a slow idle speed, the outboard screw would have a very noticeable effect on the engine speed and smoothness with just a 1/4 turn left or right of the 'sweet spot'. The inboard mixture screw could be turned in or out about a full turn before a noticeable change could be detected.. and I could not get the engine to run rich enough or smooth as it should with the inboard mixture partially clogged like this. I re-rebuilt the carb, dunking it in some very strong carb dip tank chemicals, and it looked spotless, and I used 'tag wire' to fish through every passageway I could locate, and every jet had been removed, cleaned and inspected with a magnifying glass. But the inboard idle mixture was still partially clogged and not responsive to adjustment. So I just lived with a slightly rough idle for years in this car, I did locate a spare EE-3 carb but didn't install it before the car 'fixed itself'.. On a Pierce Arrow National meet in Bartlett NH, one of our tours was to Mt Washington, and the opportunity was offered to take our cars up the mountain. I couldn't resist.. So I took the '33 Pierce up the mountain road, 1st gear all the way, I had to stop a few times to let the car's fuel lines cool down, to stop the vapor lock, and then proceed on up the hill. Once at the top, we went through the gift shop etc, then proceeded on down the mountain. The decent was uneventful, just closed-throttle in first gear, using engine braking all the way, and a little wheel braking for some of the switchback turns. The only excitement was when the trans jumped out of gear in the middle of a turn, I seemed to have not enough hands for a moment there. At the bottom of the mountain, we rejoined most of the tour cars that had not gone up the mountain. As I parked the car, I noticed the engine was idling quite rough, much more so than before the run up and down Mt Washington.. I opened the hood and thought the engine was running very rich, the outboard idle mixture setting was still correct, it was in it's 'sweet-spot'.. but the inboard mixture screw took over 1/2 a turn in [leaner] to smooth out the engine, and surprise !! the engine idled smooth as glass. I was able to balance a nickel on it's side on the cylinder head. Apparently, descending the steep hill using closed-throttle engine braking for about 20-30 minutes had drawn so much fuel at much higher than normal manifold vacuum, that the fuel flow had finally after several years washed clean the idle passageway. And it's stayed clean ever since. GLong
  15. I'd point out that your Lead Acid battery didn't survive the abuse of overcharging either. An optima is a very good battery, and is subject to damage just like a Lead Acid battery, but it might be damaged easier. I simply add the ammeter to my instrument scan, and after say 20 minutes of driving, I'll turn on the headlights to bring the charge rate to near zero. It's safer to have headlights on anyway, and the lights consume the excess charge rate. Another fix is to add internal voltage regulation using modern small electronics inside the generator cut-out box on your car. Personally I like Optimas. They can be put into and removed from the battery box under the floor boards of our 20's and 30's cars much easier and safer than a lead ACID battery. And they are lighter. I've not ruined any upholstery or clothing since I started using Optima batteries. GLong