Doodle Bug Scooters

[marc1959]

Hey Scooter Guy, thanks for the reply.
I haven't thrown anything out, but all the bits are in a bucket so that's going to be fun, especially since I dismantled it 4 years ago!
My Cushman friend used to have a small engine shop in Washington State years ago and actually did training at Briggs, he got it running but didn't dismantle anything, even the plug looks well corroded in there.
The one gosh *@#$ thing i did was snap the jack shaft mount when removing the axle, but I had it re-welded (not very well) so it needs to be cut again and done properly, although it will 'work' as is.
The gas tank cleaned up pretty well, it had a mouse nest in it, but some of the threaded part that the lid screws to is missing from rust so a new one would be good.
The folks who used to own it were never able to locate the belt guard, so I don't have one.
I got new tires from Coker, I don't know if you've ever seen those, but they are not what I'd call a very accurate remake, the tread is about 3/8" narrower (a lot when placed next to the General Jumbo's) and have Made in Vietnam quite prominently embossed in the sidewall......not cheap either, I've seen dolly tires at Harbor Freight that are a closer representation in build even if they don't have the cross hatching and General Jumbo written on them (and about $8 each).
I do have a question about paint.
I imagine it was a single stage enamel, and maybe just 'red' my initial thought was to rattle can it and I have done that to the wheels and front fender, is there something more correct, I have a guy lined up who will spray everything for me professionally if I want.
I don't want to put a fortune into this, just tidy it up, but do it as correctly as possible, I was thinking of taking the seat spring to a mattress manufacturer to see if they could replicate it, but I guess most folk just use a block of foam rubber.
Anywho, thanks for the answer and advice, I really do need some motivation to get started on this, as it's been four years already, but it will make a nice winter project, I'll take pics as I go, anyone is welcome to urge me along
-Marc

[budlee03r6]

hi im brandon i had been cleaning out my granfathers farm and found a scooter under some stuuf no motor but not in bad shape was about to scrap it when i decided to look on the internet and found it was a doodlebug i later found a motor in the barn still on wood blocks never started with the briggs tag still on it from my research i believe its from the later model wondering if anyone can tell me if i should restore it it had been sanded down a little bit but over all in very good condition all i am missing is the red lense from the tail light and the two clamps from the gas tank i bought a new seat i was wondering if i should just put it back together and keep it the way it is or strip it down and do a full redo i think this was the model c numbers from the engine are model np type 306715 serial 713826 on the tag on the neck read model says nothing serial 153290 type w 1046 and a triangle inside a circle my grandfather also gave me the owners manual to it and the original pa title and actually i just looked at the title and it says the engine # and its the same as the engine thats on the blocks so any help would be good im going to try to upload some pics

[marc1959]

Wow! what a cool find! Maybe the engine was sent away for maintenance and never re-installed. That's the first time I've seen the Western Flyer logo on one of these.
I'm no expert, Scooter Guy will chime in hopefully, but it looks to me like the side skirts have squared off ends and maybe that's a fluid clutch, which would indicate it's a fairly early model.

[Scooter Guy]

Marc,

To respond directly to a couple of things you mentioned:

There are multiple versions of the belt guard, so make sure you get one for a late production Super Doodle Bug (Briggs engine). The mounting points are different for the very earliest scooters and for the Clinton Engine scooters. Also, yours should have the three slot guard.

It is interesting to hear your experience with the Coker tires. They are regarded as the only "correct" available tire. I have not seen them marked that they are made in Vietnam. For what it's worth, I always save the tires (if at all possible) but it's not really very safe to even cosider riding on 60+ year old tires.

Yes, paint was originally single stage "red." I've had mine professionally painted and I don't know exactly what paint code was used. Most guys that restore them have them clear coated, too. It especially helps to protect the decals which were the water slide type. I've spray painted plenty of stuff, but wouldn't do it to a Doodle Bug, personally. Maybe you're a better painter than I am, but I save the spray paint for stuff like the patio set that sits outside year 'round.

[Scooter Guy]

Brandon,

Thanks for posting. It appears, from looking at the photos, that the scooter is an early model C sold by Western Auto as a Western Flyer.

I came to that conclusion because of the following:

1. "Horse's hoof" side panels
2. No pulley cut out on side panels (would indicate later model)
3. Handlebars that appear to be for the single control lever
4. Briggs NP engine with fluid drive clutch

I can't tell what the finish really looks like since your photos are pretty small. In some of the photos the sanding that was done looks pretty serious, while in other areas the paint appears to be untouched. I would restore it, but remember they are only original once. If there is enough there, leave it in its original finish. There are very few complete machines that have original paint and such.

If you do repaint it, I would order new side panels from Yesterdays rides and keep the ones that you have (at least the one with the Western Flyer decal) aside. Personally, I'd rather use a reproduction part with reproduction decals than paint over that one.

It's interesting that the engine was pulled and set aside. If the numbers match the original paperwork, the engine is most likely the original one to the bike. I wonder if it was pulled due to problems actually in the fluid drive and sent out for service. The fluid drive clutches were known to be problematic and were phased out fairly quickly in favor of the V-plex.

Unless your grandfather is available to tell you, it's likely that nobody will ever know exactly why it was torn apart. Perhaps someone intended to restore it at some earlier point? That might make the most sense and would also explain why some areas were sanded and why the ID tags were pulled off the frame.

Do you only have what's pictured? If so, be aware that you're missing a lot of the smaller parts and "detail" items.

[Scooter Guy]

Unless it has been all hacked up lately, have a look at the Doodle Bug Scooter wikipedia article. I originally wrote and posted the content (and periodically have to change it back). The wikipedia police don't like the fact that I don't cite and sources or give any reference material, but so what...I've got tons of factory documentation and have taped conversations from people that designed them and worked in the factory. Those are my sources. I wrote the entry to help people know when they've come across a Doodle Bug scooter. Perhaps it will be beneficial to you.

UPDATE:

As of Nov. 22, 2010 my original Wikipedia entry on the Doodle Bug scooter is all but gone. Most of the information in the currently available entry is incorrect. I will no longer claim any responsibility for the content and will not continue to battle with anonymous "editors" of my content that think they know better. Instead, I will monitor this thread and respond to posts and questions posted here as I am able to.

This thread currently contains the most authoratative information available online for the Doodle Bug Motor Scooter.

If there's something you want to know that hasn't been talked about here, please send me a private message or post your question for all to see. I'm happy to help out and hope that having this information out there keeps a couple more Doodle Bug scooters alive. From what's been posted thus far, that seems to be the case.

[budlee03r6]

i have everything but the red tail lense and the two brackets that go over the gas tank what is this thing worth the way it is and what would it be worth completed

[jfred]

Hi guys, I am Fred and live in Missouri. I have a couple of Doodle Bugs as well as a custom built 3 wheel bug with a box in the front. I use it for looking for scooter parts at scooter meets.
One of my Doodle Bugs is a Clinton engine model that appears to be unrestored and the other is a Super Doodle Bug with a Briggs engine. I also have a For All which was based on the Doodle Bug but built 10 years after the Doodle Bug went out of production.
I have several Cushman scooters as well as a Vespa, a Silver Pigeon and am working on restoring an Indian Papoose. As you probably already know if you are on this thread, old scooters are an illness but sure a lot of fun.
If you can, you should try to make the Doodle Bug reunion held in September each year in Webster City, Iowa. It is a fun and very laid back scooter meet with a great group of people.

[Scooter Guy]

It seems Harry Mertz designed the whole
scooter himself. All the dimensions are simple inch
sizes and the angles are 10 degree increments or
so.

The designer and/or inventor of the Doodle Bug Scooter is a bit of a mystery. Many of the patents that were filed for the design are attributed to Harry Mertz of Webster City, Iowa, which is where the plant (Beam Manufacturing was located). However, in all of Harry Mertz's patents, he assigned the patent to the Solar Corporation, Milwaukee, Wis, a corporation of Delaware.

Where it gets a little tricky is that patents were also filed by George Fields and assigned to the Solar Corporation for the scooter. George Fields actually applied for a patent with his design 6 months before Mertz did.

It is entirely possible that these two people knew each other and were working on the same project as the were assigning their patent applications to the same company.

Fields also received patents for most of the components that actually made the scooter work...the control mechanism and fluid drive clutch. Interestingly, Mertz also received patents for some components including another design of the fluid clutch, drive adjuster (belt tensioner), and the drive wheel assembly.

It seems to me that even though the patent for the final design of the scooter is attributed to Mertz, that Fields actually did most of the work as his patent for "motor vehicle control mechanism for sequentially controlling wheel braking and motor speed" illustrates a "primitive" Doodle Bug Scooter including all of the major components that were later attributed to Mertz. Going by that, Fields actually "invented" it and did, in fact, receive a patent for it a full 3 years before Mertz did (1943 vs. 1946).

On top of all of that, the "old timers" and those that worked in the plant claim it was all Fields. Maybe Fields had some sort of "selective memory," but in video taped interviews I have of him, he claims to have invented the scooter and pitched building it to the Beam Manufacturing Company in Webster City, Iowa. No mention of Mertz or any other "help," corporate or otherwise.

Fields eventually wound up in Webster City and worked for Beam as the person that was essentially in charge of their scooter operations.

I suppose the most mysterious aspect is who/what the Solar Corporation was and what Mertz and Fields' ties to them were. Nobody I've talked with really seems to know.

[caddy55]

Hi Guys!
Brand new member here..and the proud owner of a Doodlebug! I bought it last week at an auction from the original owner who bought it in 1948, I have known him all my life and never knew he had it,it was stored hanging from the rafters in an old shed, the scooter is all original and even has the original tires which are in very good shape yet it is missing the left side cover, he said the belt broke one day and he hung it up where it had remained untouched for a long time.
He told me he bought it from a Western Auto store in New York state.
It has the NP Briggs engine however the kick start broke and has been replaced with a rope start.
The side covers read Hiawatha and the tag is as follows
model is blank, serial number 151744, type W1046A.
It has one control for the gas and brake, I have never ridden one and cant imagine how that would work!
I am from S.E. Iowa and I wanted one for the historical aspect of it from Iowa.
Thanks ahead of time and I will post pictures soon.

[Scooter Guy]

Caddy 55,

Great story!

Please post photos, if possible. I'd love to have a look.

Going on the the tag information that you posted, your scooter was indeed purchased from Western Auto. It was a model A, according to the tag. A scooter purchased from Western Auto would have been a "Western Flyer" badged scooter, and not a "Hiawatha," so perhaps the sidecovers are not original to the machine? Does it have a Western Auto headbadge or a Hiawatha headbadge with the Indian head on it?

Do you have the fluid drive clutch?
Original 5-slot belt guard?
Flared out side cover?

Any accessories (lights?)
Original paperwork?

When using the single control remember that you pull in to stop and that when you release the control lever, the scooter will take off full blast.

The kick start base for the engine is hard to come by. I do not beleive that it has ever been reproduced, so you'll most likely have to locate another engine and strip it for the parts. I know I sound like a broken record saying that stuff is hard to come by, but it is.

[Scooter Guy]

September 15-15, 2011 is the Doodle Bug Reunion at the Hamilton County Fairgrounds in Webster City, IA, the home of the Doodle Bug.

The is the largest gathering of Doodle Bug scooters anywhere. The weekend structure is rather informal, but usually includes buy/sell area (and Don Jackson and Jim Kilau come with repro parts) and organized rides. In recent years the organized ride was the original test ride route through Webster City. I assume that will be offered again this year. Surving former Beam Manufacturing company employees usually attend and answer questions as well.

[caddy55]

yea Im an idiot....it says western flyer not hiawatha...I am missing a left side cover which is steel, (love to find a unrestored one) and I am missing the kick start assembly, the base looks fine. I just talked with one of the orginizers of the annual meet here in Iowa and he has seen my scooter and thinks it is an earlier model...scooter guy,why is my model section of the tag blank?..any ideas? as far as the clutch cover mine has four slots across the front and three on the side, it has one hand control, and has a sediment bowl on the carb if that means anything, the man I bought it from says the bike is all original except the rope start.
I plan to leave this as I found it cosmetically and make sure it is sound mechanically, I do plan to put a battery light kit back on it as well...thanks..Lynn

[Scooter Guy]

From your tag on the frame, it left the factory configured as a model A, the first of the Doodle Bugs. Probably made in 1946 or early 1947. It sounds like the only non model A part you've got on your hands is the belt guard, which should have 5 slots on the big side.

For reference, it would have left the factory with a Briggs & Stratton NP cast iron kick start engine, 1.5hp, a fluid drive clutch with a 5 slot belt guard, pointed white grips, side covers that are flared out at the bottom (not rounded off), a single control lever, fuel shut off valve in the gas tank, and the fuel filter (glass) mounted on the engine rather than on the gas tank, and a push/pull kill switch.

Now that isn't to say that you don't have a model A Doodle Bug just because a model A specific part or two is missing. Parts that were broken or lost over the years may have been replaced with parts from later models. Such was the case with the model A that I have. It was so "wrong" that I initially identified it as an early model C until I looked past the parts and zeroed in on the frame tag and the other thngs that did point to it being a model A (it is).

Beam Manufacturing was not very consistent about some of the details like decals and stamping the serial tag. Probably only 1 in every 10 original Doodle Bugs I've seen actually has a model number stamped on the model line. Most were simply left blank, but since the W1046A is known to signify a model A sold at Western Auto, having the model line stamped in isn't as critical.

As an aside, the side covers were made in steel and aluminum. Aluminum covers are very rare and were used for only a short while on the very earliest production Doodle Bugs. Most have the steel side covers like you have. Beam actually used a pretty interesting mix of materials on the scooter that includes brass, bronze, steel, aluminum, and (if you count the motor) cast iron.

Please post or send photos. I'd love to see photos of a relatively untouched machine...there aren't many of those left in decent condition.

[Gunpilot]

I have two Hiawatha Doodlebugs. One is running but not driving due to clutch issues. The other is still a basket case. Glad to see this activity here. For the longest, there has been very little reference on the internet. Any ideas on the exact length or belt number for the drive belt on a Super? Neither of my scooters had a belt when I got them about a year ago. Great thread.

[Scooter Guy]

Belt and chain factory specs:

Belt is 33" long v-type B section belt.

Chain is 1/2" pitch, 3/16" wide, and factory length was 52 links.

These specs are good for both the earlier fluid drive Doodle Bug scooters (A, B, and early C) and the later scooters with v-plex/flex-i-matic/centrifugal clutches since the later clutches were a direct bolt on replacement for the problematic fluid drive units.

I'm doing what I can (little by little) to get good, accurate information online. So far this thread has been the best place to do it...this pops up on Google and has, all things considered, received strong response.

Also, a reminder to all that I'm happy to answer questions and do still keep tabs on this thread. Post here or send a private message with anything you might like to know.

[Gunpilot]

Belt and chain factory specs:

Belt is 33" long v-type B section belt.

Chain is 1/2" pitch, 3/16" wide, and factory length was 52 links.

These specs are good for both the earlier fluid drive Doodle Bug scooters (A, B, and early C) and the later scooters with v-plex/flex-i-matic/centrifugal clutches since the later clutches were a direct bolt on replacement for the problematic fluid drive units.

I'm doing what I can (little by little) to get good, accurate information online. So far this thread has been the best place to do it...this pops up on Google and has, all things considered, received strong response.

Also, a reminder to all that I'm happy to answer questions and do still keep tabs on this thread. Post here or send a private message with anything you might like to know.

Scooter Guy,
Thanks so much for the rapid reply.

Finding this forum today motivated me to drag my running scooter out from under the work bench. Kicked it twice and it fired right up.

I measured what I thought to be a fairly accurate guesstimate for belt size and went to my local Autozone with the data. No luck. By the way, I came up with 30" on the inside which equates to 33" outside diameter, but my assumption is that your reference of 33" is to the inside dimension. I'll go to NAPA tomorrow and try my luck at the 33".

I have another question if I may. I was looking at the photos Marc posted. It appears by looking at both his photos as well as the parts diagram, that I'm missing parts that hold tension against the idler or jack pulley to the frame. Mine has a spring, eye-bolt, and small "J" shaped piece of metal (that fits over the rear fender brace), all connected together. But again it looks as if I'm missing something on the top side that would also have an adjustment bolt that passes through a tab welded to the left rear frame down tube, beneath the seat. I'm curious what this part is for and if I can fabricate a replacement.

Are you aware of any photos or diagrams that would better illustrate what I'm trying to ask above?

I have other comments and questions, but I'll post them in a seperate post. I don't want to hi-jack your thread here.

Again, thanks so much for building this forum and the rapid response. I'll try to post a photo or two of my Doodlebugs later too.
thanks.

[Gunpilot]

Hey Scooter Guy, thanks for the reply.
I haven't thrown anything out, but all the bits are in a bucket so that's going to be fun, especially since I dismantled it 4 years ago!
My Cushman friend used to have a small engine shop in Washington State years ago and actually did training at Briggs, he got it running but didn't dismantle anything, even the plug looks well corroded in there.
The one gosh *@#$ thing i did was snap the jack shaft mount when removing the axle, but I had it re-welded (not very well) so it needs to be cut again and done properly, although it will 'work' as is.
The gas tank cleaned up pretty well, it had a mouse nest in it, but some of the threaded part that the lid screws to is missing from rust so a new one would be good.
The folks who used to own it were never able to locate the belt guard, so I don't have one.
I got new tires from Coker, I don't know if you've ever seen those, but they are not what I'd call a very accurate remake, the tread is about 3/8" narrower (a lot when placed next to the General Jumbo's) and have Made in Vietnam quite prominently embossed in the sidewall......not cheap either, I've seen dolly tires at Harbor Freight that are a closer representation in build even if they don't have the cross hatching and General Jumbo written on them (and about $8 each).
I do have a question about paint.
I imagine it was a single stage enamel, and maybe just 'red' my initial thought was to rattle can it and I have done that to the wheels and front fender, is there something more correct, I have a guy lined up who will spray everything for me professionally if I want.
I don't want to put a fortune into this, just tidy it up, but do it as correctly as possible, I was thinking of taking the seat spring to a mattress manufacturer to see if they could replicate it, but I guess most folk just use a block of foam rubber.
Anywho, thanks for the answer and advice, I really do need some motivation to get started on this, as it's been four years already, but it will make a nice winter project, I'll take pics as I go, anyone is welcome to urge me along
-Marc

Marc,
Neat project. Your's looks very similar to the better of the two doodlebugs I got last year. Like you I was curious about the paint. I'm sure Scooter Guy can steer us accurately, but somewhere I read that the correct color was the same as a red stripe used on old Cessna airplanes. I had my auto paint supplier look it up and he came up with Cessna Flag Red as the color. I had a small amount mixed in acrylic enamel so I could test it. Looks pretty close to me. Just thought I'd pass it on.
vr
Greg

[Scooter Guy]

Like you I was curious about the paint. I'm sure Scooter Guy can steer us accurately, but somewhere I read that the correct color was the same as a red stripe used on old Cessna airplanes. I had my auto paint supplier look it up and he came up with Cessna Flag Red as the color.
Greg

Yes, Cessna Flag Red is the right color...checked with the painter.

Because the paint world is has changed so much, most guys have been forced to go from lacquer to acrylic enamel used with hardener to urethane paint. We'll probably end up being forced into water based! Nonetheless, Cessna Flag Red has long been the color of choice.

Where did you discover that it was a Cessna color? Very, very few people ever go to the trouble to find out, instead opting for some shade of "red."

Let me look through my things and the photos I've got to see what sort of assistance I can offer regarding the requests in the previous post about possible missing parts, tensioner, etc.

[gabbysmom]

Brandon, do not get rid of that stuff. There is a Doodlebug reunion held ever year in Webster City, Iowa. This year is the 25th reunion. Webster City is the place these doodlebugs were manufactured. There are many people that need parts. If you want more information, let me know and I can probably help you.

[gabbysmom]

Have you ever been to the Doodlebug Reunion in Webster City. It will be the 25th annual reunion this year. It will be Sept.15-17 at the Hamilton County Fair Grounds. I go every year. They have original not restored, and restored and loads of parts. Believe me they know the history of the doodlebug at this reunion.

[caddy55]

Hi Guys,
Anyone have a original left side cover for my Western Flyer ?...beat up and rough is ok to fit in with the rest of my scooter, I could use a battery light kit also, all I have left is part of a tail light,....my ratchet and kick start will be waiting for me in Webster City,
I actually got to ride a Doodlebug back in May,very cool!!....! wife wasnt impressed much though, oh well....thanks....Lynn

[caddy55]

Hi Guys,
Anyone have a original left side cover for my Western Flyer ?...beat up and rough is ok to fit in with the rest of my scooter, I could use a battery light kit also, all I have left is part of a tail light,....my ratchet and kick start will be waiting for me in Webster City,
I actually got to ride a Doodlebug back in May,very cool!!....! wife wasnt impressed much though, oh well....thanks....Lynn

UPDATE: On the way back to Iowa from North Carolina today we made a detour to the scooter meet in Portland Indiana.....turn out they said was down however I thought it was scooter overload of all kinds ...will definetly be on the roster for 2012...also I might have found my sidecover for my 47 doodle bug!.....Lynn

[jimbjuneau]

7-15-2011
I just acquired an unrestored, running 1946 Doodlebug w/ Clinton engine that needs a v belt and a rear tire.
I know nothing about these and am looking to just put it back to drivable condition in order to sell it. I don't know what would be a fair price though.
Incidentally, the unit is rust free - I was told it was never kept outside.
Jim
Minnesota
E-mail: jimb.juneau@yahoo.com

[bchevy]

Look what I found today! It came with registrations from 1967, this was titled! It has Western Auto on the neck.