Help again - this time with getting '50 drums off

[Gary_N]

Yep, as usual, this is the first place I come to for help.....yet again.

So, finally I 'finish' getting the brakes done on Yoda. Well I though, but, I realized that I left off a part to the rear brakes. Easy to forget if you have parts scattered all over...like me of course. Anyway, I never tighten the adjusted so I figured the drums would just slide off....and the left rear did. Well, for some reason I cannot get the driver side rear drum off. I mean it spins around the shoes and moves in and out but will not come off no matter what I do. I tried for an hour and decided it was beer time.

Has anyone ever had this problem?

Thanks!

Gary

[Robberbach]

First thing, did you remove the centering bolt that holds the drum on? I know, it may sound stupid. Next, take a hammer and gently pound on the edge facing out, around the outside ring. Sometimes rust will hold it on like that. A few gentle taps should take care of it. Next prybars.

Did you have the drum s turned, otherwise there may be a lip inside holding things in place.

[Gary_N]

Drums turned; blasted; painted and looked nice until this issue. The bolts are off. I guess it's a helper to hold while I tap on the back. Still doesn't make any sense to me why it just won't slip off. Just more stuff to make me crazy I guess.

Thanks!

Gary

[old-tank]

Gary
Back off the adjuster for the shoes AND the parking brake cable. What part did you leave off...may explain why it won't come off.
Willie

[Gary_N]

Willie, the adjuster is backed off all the way. The drivers side slipped right off. Left the part off both sides. It's the flat piece that runs across both shoes just under the wheel cylinder with a coil spring on one end. Didn't touch the parking brake cable. Will loosen tonight. Actually, I think the part I left off has to do with the parking brake. Stupid me!

Gary

[Dave41]

Gary ,the part you left off is part of the parking brake it pushes the shoe opposite the one that the cable pulls
dave

[special55]

Hey Gary,


What did you do to **** Yoda off man????


If you left out the parking brake strut loosening the cable won't help. If these drums were turned that would rule out the rust ridge that builds up on the edge.



Does the drum turn freely or is there considerable drag on the shoes. I have made the mistake of turning the adjuster the wrong way and actually tightening the shoes instead of loosening them.


If it is turning free then it seams like the only thing left is the drum hanging ob the axle. Maybe just hit the edge of the drum next to the backing plate in the direction of the outside of the car. Just be careful not to hit the backing plate.


It really doesn't make any sense that this thing is hanging up.


Good Luck,

Rich

[trp3141592]

Hi Gary,

I'm not sure about your '50's rear brake construction, but I had a similar experience with the Roadmonster. So, I am assuming that the rear wheels/tires on your car are BOLTED on, rather than putting NUTS on studs. This assumes that the drum does NOT have studs and does NOT have a center big ole slip-on taper with a 2" or so nut on it. Right? (If your drums do have a big old taper-fit hub and big ole center nut, you'll be buying or renting a tool. But have no fear--the tool actually works.)

If so, here'a a couple of thoughts based on my Monster.

1. Look on the face of the drum for a 1/4" or so bolt (7/16" head) on the face of the drum, ie, where it would be against the back side of the wheel. It might be a slotted screw head--who knows? This (these) bolt(s) may or may not be there. It (they) holds and aligns the drum on to the hub when the tire and wheel are off. As I recall, there could be three of them.

2. There should be one, and possibly up to three, pointy studs, or pins, about an inch and a half long and 1/4" - 5/16" diameter, that are screwed into the outside face of the drum just like the bolt(s) I mentioned about. They stick out through the small holes in the wheel. They have a hex-head at the base for a wrench to grip upon for removal. These are what GM laughingly supplied to guide and support the spare wheel as you wrestle around in the mud (It ALWAYS is raining when you have to install the spare) trying to install the wheel bolts. Past owners may have yanked the aforementioned bolts and installed multiple pins in the bolt holes to try to support the loose wheel and tire as you attempt to install the lug bolts. I know that I did just that, but then I made a set of heavy duty guides that actually work.

Whether pins or bolts, they will prevent the drum from coming off. They unscrew easily. This should make it possible to remove the drum.

If the drum is surface-rusted on to the hub, there is a puller made for the problem, though ususally some PB Blaster and some tap-hammering with a heavy hammer will break them loose. I have had occasion to use this type of puller (modern Chevy trucks require it). But first check out the above pins/bolts in the face of the drum and see if that resolves the issue.

For future reference, when installing a wheel and tire it's always a pain to try to hold the heavy wheel and tire as you attempt to get lug bolts into place. One solution is to have a set of heavy-duty guides that you put into the lug bolt holes to wholly support and hold the spare in place as you start three of the lug bolts. Then you remove the guides and install the remaining lug bolts. I make those guides if you want a set: $19.00 a set plus postage. Just keep them in the trunk for when the occasion arises.

Let us know how this works out.

--Tom

[Thriller]

Gary - I think I know what your problem is...you fought with this for a whole hour before going to clear your head with beer. Man, you are so much more patient than I am.

[Gary_N]

Well thanks for the ears guys and girls, if there are any out there. It took three set of hands to get the drum off, one to hold the drum and two with a big screw driver and hammer on each side of the back of the drum. Three good simultaneous whacks and it came off. I'm hoping the part I left out somehow caused this issue. I had the emergency cable loosened all the way but that made no difference at all.

This is all very odd to me. The drum spun around without an issue and moved in and out a 1/4 inch. The adjuster was backed off all the way. I could see from the adjuster slot in the back that this was the case. Just one of those old car curse things???

Then Yoda hit me again. This time with the front brake hoses. Seems there's more '49 parts on this car than '50 parts. Anyway, thank god for good neighbors and UPS. And thank god for old tools. Now I can get the brake springs on an off with ease...sorta!

Thanks again for the help and ears. Wish some of you lived near by. It's nice having neighbors to help out but they aren't what you'd call old Buick guys! Seems I'm the old guy that likes old Buicks and they're the young not so into old cars neighbors.

Gary

[Gary_N]

Tom, its always raining when you get a flat. I live out in the woods and until recently, we had an 1/4 mile gravel private drive for the 5 neighbor properties. I've had a flat tire on every car I own including a truck (with like million ply tires) as a result of this drive EXCEPT for the 14 year old Bias Ply tires on my '50. We've since paved the drive and I have 5 nice new Diamond Back WWW radials to put on. Watch, now I'll get a flat! I may take you up on your guides soon.

Gary

[trp3141592]

Hi Gary,

I have a rear drum off of Baby at the moment. I think the shoes, lever, et al are the same as your Buick. I'll photograph the parking brake lever installation for you and post it tomorrow late afternoon so you have a reassembly guide.

I remain curious as to what hung up the drum. Do you have one (1) primary and one (1) secondary shoe on each side?

:-)

--Tom

[Gary_N]

Tom, no need to post the picture. Thanks for the thought. It's back together. I take lots of pictures when I take things apart. Now if I had looked at the pictures before I buttoned up the rears I wouldn't have had this problem.

I looked all over the drum once removed. I cannot for the life of me figure out why it wouldn't slid off. Maybe the machine shop messed up the job when they turned the drums??? I can't imagine that was the issue. I guess I should measure around the drum to see if maybe that was the case. Obviously the drum was stuck on the shoe. So maybe it is a funky turn job. I hope not. I don't want to bank them off again.

Thanks again for the help.

Gary

[Gary_N]

Just an FYI: It actually looks like the end of the axle is the issue. It seems both drums will easily slide onto the drivers side but will not slide onto the other side. How can this be? Who knows but it really feels like the drum does not just slip over the end of the axle. You have to bang it on (lightly), which means it's back to needing three sets of hands to get it off. Hopefully I won't have to do that for a good long while! I guess axles get fat like old guys when they get older?!

Gary

[trp3141592]

Hi Gary,

The synapses in what passes for my brain started firing off as I remembered a similar problem that I encountered with the Monster. That's why I asked if you had one primary and one secondary shoe at each wheel. I had new linings put on the front shoes of the Monster, and I rather cavalierly installed the rebuilt shoes on both sides. Funny thing, the left drum went on the driver's side easily, but the right-side drum would not slide easily onto the passenger side--it was a very tight wedged-on fit like the shoe linings were too thick.

The mistake I made was easily rectified once I saw what I had done. The brakes require one primary and one secondary shoe on each side. They have different lining material and different thickness of lining material. I had put the two primararies on one side and the two secondaries on the other. With the thickness of the linings being different, I had essentially put two fat boys together on the passenger side. The cure was simple enough--swap shoes around to where they are supposed to be.

I don't know for sure about your late-'49/early-50, but typically the shoes can be differentiated from each other by the length of the lining---one lining is shorter than the other. When deciding which shoe goes where, the rule of thumb is "The short shoe goes to the front."

Hope this helps.

--Tom

[Gary_N]

Tom, I don't think this is my issue. The shoes are identical. The drum spins freely, it just does not like to easily pass over the axle.

Thanks for the info. Go to know for future garage maidens!

Gary