Pennsylvania Year of Manufacture Plates

[Oldsfan]

I was at a show the other week and there was a '59 Corvette there with an original '59 PA license plate on the back. My buddy asked how that guy was getting away with it. His dad said it was recently made legal to run Year of Manufacture plates on the back in PA. I hadn't heard that. I've been waiting for years to run a Y-O-M plate on my car. Can anyone confirm this?

Paul

[nearchoclatetown]

That would be great news if true. I have not heard this yet, hope you are right.

[charlier]

The PENNDOT Driver and Vehicle Services web site does not mention anything about Y-O-M plates.
There is also a page that contains "Legislation Affecting Drivers and Vehicles" but even this page does not mention the Y-O-M plates.

These findings do not mean there has not been a change.
I guess time will tell if there has been a change made or not.

[Dave@Moon]

According to this article by John Gunnell at Hagerty.com (Hagerty Insurance), and the web site linked in that article, YOM plates have been legal in PA since at least 2005. This is the first I've heard of it myself.

[charlier]

Originally Posted By: Dave@Moon

According to this article by John Gunnell at Hagerty.com (Hagerty Insurance), and the web site linked in that article, YOM plates have been legal in PA since at least 2005. This is the first I've heard of it myself.

Thanks for the article link.

The optimist in me hopes this information is true.
Unfortunately, the skeptic in me says the web site linked in the article does not provide a link to the official
PENNDOT or official State of PA web site so at this point I am not convinced.

Maybe someone from AACA National can contact PENNDOT in Harrisburg or one of the legislators there for
Official information concerning this issue????

[Restorer32]

Penn-Dot's web site makes no mention of YOM plates that I can find nor do they list any forms to accomplish YOM plate registration. I renew all of my PA registrations online and suspect that if YOM plates were in fact legal there would be a form and a fee to register them. I do know folks who use a YOM plate and keep the legal plate in the trunk in case they are pulled over. Just cause people do it doesn't make it legal. I hope I'm wrong as I have a beautiful set of '32s I'd like to use.

[Bhigdog]

A few years ago I spent a few hours in Harrisburg trying to convince the MV people to allow me to use a restored 1939 plate on my pick up. A got a few layers up the chain of command before I was told "NO WAY". I don't think anything has changed. I run the plate but keep the real one in the glove box. If (when) I'm stopped the plan is to smack my self in the forehead and say "I forgot". If the cop is a hard a** it will be about a $100 lesson........Bob

[Dave@Moon]

Originally Posted By: Bhigdog

I run the plate but keep the real one in the glove box. If (when) I'm stopped the plan is to smack my self in the forehead and say "I forgot". If the cop is a hard a** it will be about a $100 lesson........Bob

When I moved out of PA in 2001 they weren't legal yet. I don't know who or when or if they're legal now, but I hope they are.

BTW, if the cop's a "hard a**" I'm pretty sure it's actually a much bigger fine than $100.00, plus court costs. [img]<>/shocked.gif[/img] The $100.00 penalty is for obscuring the display of the correct registration plate [25 PA Code Sec. 1332(c)]. The penalty for not displaying the plate at all isn't specified, and that's the least of your problems.

The big penalty will be for displaying a false registration plate. Neither penalty (no plate/false plate) is specifically spelled out in the regs, which usually means it's a statuatory violation. Also after the fine, which I imagine based on experience will probably be in the low four digit range, I'd be very surprised if you were allowed to keep the car! You could even do light time or community service for this. [img]<>/shocked.gif[/img] [img]<>/shocked.gif[/img] [img]<>/shocked.gif[/img]

As a relative measure I know the fine for failing to register at all was $650.00 15-20 years ago. I think they'll take this to be a worse violation.

Still want to go trolling for "hard a** cops"? [img]<>/frown.gif[/img]

In Ohio, and I believe all other YOM states, the YOM plate is registered to the car offically. You may or may not need a current plate kept in the car (like in OH), but certainly the police have to be able to ID the car as belonging to you using the numbers displayed. You can bet if PA has OKed YOM plates it isn't a casual, "go ahead and hang whatever you want on your car" type thing!

See: PA Registration of Vehicle regulations in PA Code

[Dave@Moon]

Quote:

Penn-Dot's web site makes no mention of YOM plates that I can find nor do they list any forms to accomplish YOM plate registration. I renew all of my PA registrations online and suspect that if YOM plates were in fact legal there would be a form and a fee to register them.

I believe antique registrations are still permenant in PA, and therefore they wouldn't show up in the renewal web site whether YOM plates are legal or not. Unless PENNDOT has done something really innovative, (I'll pause while some of you stop laughing [img]<>/grin.gif[/img]), I don't think there's an online initial registration service or form in PA. Everything's still handled at the notary.

[Oldsfan]

I don't know why PENNDOT fights these plates so. ALL of the states surrounding us allow them, and you'd think PENNDOT would want the additional revenue it would generate (and I beleive it would generate a lot!). I mean, after all, this is the state that allows the Flagship Niagara plates which can't even been read. If the surrounding states can devise a system for the use of YOM plates, PENNDOT should be able to.

Regarding the current YOM legislation referred to above, I believe this relates to the use of YOM plates on the FRONT for display purposes. I was told in the early 90s that YOM plates displayed on the front were actually illegal, although it was common practice. I think the 2005 ruling made it legal for YOM plates to be displayed on the front.

Paul

[Bhigdog]

Ahhh, life lived on the edge. Gotta love it!. OK, new ploy. Hows this? "I'M OLD, I'M CONFUSED, YOU MEAN IT'S NOT 1939?"...........Bob.

[Steve Moskowitz]

Ok, I just got off the phone with the manager at PENNDOT who has the responsibility in this area. YOM Plates are NOT legal. As suggested, you can use a YOM plate on the FRONT of your car but if you are going operate your collectible car legally you have to have a PENNDOT issued license plate.

As far as living on the edge, you guys are braver than me! I can tell you of other member stories of running into a law enforcement official who is not sympathetic to old cars and has thrown the book at the driver. You may want to reconsider giving anyone a reason to stop you. We have a member dealing with a particular nasty situation now over a small matter that mushroomed.

[charlier]

Originally Posted By: Steve Moskowitz

Ok, I just got off the phone with the manager at PENNDOT who has the responsibility in this area. YOM Plates are NOT legal. As suggested, you can use a YOM plate on the FRONT of your car but if you are going operate your collectible car legally you have to have a PENNDOT issued license plate.

Steve, thank you very much for getting the answer to this question.
Hopefully some other AACA members will see this thread and not get themselves into leagl trouble they could have avoided.

[Oldsfan]

Steve, was there any discussion as to the possibility of it ever becoming legal to run YOM plates? Or why they are so opposed to it?

Paul

[Steve Moskowitz]

I really did not get into that conversation as it would need to go through legislation to get passed. I am guessing that law enforcement would object as a key thing they are trying to do is reduce the number of types and styles of license plates. I am not sure of what other issues have come up in the past.

If PA hobbyists really want this to happen then they need to get the support of their state legislators and get active. Believe it or not, these folks tend to get involve when their constituents are heavily contacting them.

[Bhigdog]

But Steve, I have my YOM plate held on by a belt, suspenders, velcro, staples and duct tape! 8-) 8-) 8-).

[Steve Moskowitz]

Yes but you need to take your plates off and then velcro, duct tape, suspenders, etc. in a drawer to make sure you don't end up behind bars! [img]<>/grin.gif[/img]

[Bhigdog]

Yeah, I guess I will..............

[imported_TheMoneyPit]

Originally Posted By: Dave@Moon

In Ohio, and I believe all other YOM states, the YOM plate is registered to the car offically. You may or may not need a current plate kept in the car (like in OH), but certainly the police have to be able to ID the car as belonging to you using the numbers displayed. You can bet if PA has OKed YOM plates it isn't a casual, "go ahead and hang whatever you want on your car" type thing!

Try again - this is exactly how Maine handles it - any PAIR of YOM plates can be displayed so long as you keep your active modern plates under your seat with all up-to-date stickers on them... There is no way to cross reference a car to the plate on the front since the number is not registered! Most of the Police officers do not know how the law actually reads so I tell everyone I know running these plates to keep a copy of the title/section with their plates and registration to avoid the hard a**es giving out tickets and wasting court time. Here is the link:State of Maine Statutes 29-a Sec 457

[MCHinson]

This is also how NC handles it. You can display any year of manufacture plate and keep the current registration plate in the car.

I also make sure that all of our chapter members have access to a copy of the legislation, just in case they run into an officer who is not familiar with the statute.

As a Police Lieutenant, I would rather see the displayed year of manufacture plate registered so I can run the tag by computer. This would help facilitate recovery in the case of a stolen antique vehicle. But, I am not going to fuss much about it, since most of the antique vehicles are being operated by good honest citizens.

[ted sweet]

In NY the YOM are the plates actually registered to the car, thieir number is what appears on the registration etc.

[Dave@Moon]

Quote:

There is no way to cross reference a car to the plate on the front since the number is not registered!

If that's true get ready for it to change pronto. If traffic enforement cameras don't change that, parking enforcement will!

Besides, if your car is stolen it's already untraceable as soon as it rounds the corner. "I'm sorry officer, it must be some other red '56 Chevy you're looking for. I found..., I mean I keep a copy of the law that lets me run these untraceable plates. See!"

(I assume you're allowed to display both YOM plates. Your post could read either both plates are YOM or just the front plate.)

[MCHinson]

NC only uses a rear plate. The YOM plate can displayed and it is untraceble to the car, but the valid registered plate has to be kept in the car along with the registration card. So, it is untraceable at a glance, but traceable after a traffic stop.

As a Police Lieutenant, I would not mind seeing the YOM plate registered to the vehicle for obvious reasons, but I also can't give you an example of a YOM plate being used to facilitate the theft of an antique vehicle or any other crime.

[imported_TheMoneyPit]

Yes, both YOM plates are on the car in Maine with the valid plates in the vehicle. To get a title there is a visit from one of the State Police Motor Vehicle Inspection Division (or something like that) who comes to the house and photographs every corner of the thing plus all numbers on the vehicle, motor, body and vin. He even took a picture of the key number on my car. As far as theft is concerned this doccumentation would be far more valuable in court as compared to the plates.

[Dave@Moon]

Quote:

As a Police Lieutenant, I would not mind seeing the YOM plate registered to the vehicle for obvious reasons,

Your neighbor state to the north being chief among them, many people abuse antique registrations severely. Combining this abuse with an untracable plate must be a monumental headache for you. As a police officer, what recourse would you have with a recalcitrant illegal parker with such an advantage (assuming he's smart enough not to antagonize the same officer/beat repeatedly or park in tow-away zones)?