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Thread: Moved to Class 04B

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  1. #1
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    Moved to Class 04B

    Other than the paint, I did everything for my 57 Metropolitan in my driveway. I did my best, had some friends critique it a bit, and I showed it at Hershey in 1997. This was the first time I had shown a car at Hershey and after parking my trailer and unloading, I was able to find my place in the show at class 27B, Production Vehicles, 56 and 57, except Chevy. Those were the days of pavement parking spots with no room to open the doors or walk around the car. Because I was on a bit of a slope, I pulled my parking brake lever back from its usual spot up under the dash, something I almost never do. Being my first show, I did not take much time to look around but rather kept at my car, doing my best to clean it up from the ride on my open trailer and make it presentable. The judges came around and looked at the car, pointed at things and then joked about something and looked at each other’s clipboards. As they were walking away, one of the judges whimsically commented, “The least you could have done was paint your emergency brake button.” The light had changed and the sun now lit up the crusty plastic that was the brake release button, hidden until then up under the dash. I went for a walk, looked at some cars, loaded back onto my trailer and went home to wait for about two weeks for the results to be available. They had given awards on Saturday night, but they could not tell me for two weeks. Finally, I got the word, they gave my car a First Junior. I did not appreciate where I was parked that day.


    The next stop was Salisbury where I noticed that people were not bringing show cars on open trailers. As I was unloading, the fellow next to me commented that when I was done I could use the sink in the front of his car trailer to clean up. As I walked around, I noticed that some of these cars were pretty nice. No Senior tab for me at this show.
    In 98 I got my Senior tab in Buffalo. My first try at a First Grand National was Montoursville in 2000. It was raining a little and I helped the guy next to me with the plastic drop cloth he was using to keep the rain off the new top of his Chrysler. It’s a bit of a blur to me now, but I think this car took the trophy for best car shown at an AACA meet in 2000. And there it was, right next to me in 27B. No trophy for me. I was starting to understand.


    It was about 1000 miles to Moline. Still up on an open trailer, we got lost stopping to see friends on the way out and ended up on a dirt road with rocks and dust. My friend helped clean it up a bit and we went on to a great show. The boat tour was fun and the tractors were green and my second Second Place plaque is still on my trophy wall. It’s been said that once you are beaten by a car in AACA, you usually do not compete with it again. Right, but these guys kept bringing back new cars. And what beauties they were. It was here that I noticed the big car carrier unloading all those trailer queens with Montana plates.


    The Grand National Show in New Bern in 2002 was nice. So were the cars. I think it was here that I asked the nice man in the straw hat if he had one of every 56 model ever made. He calmly replied, “No, only the convertibles.” My third Second Place trophy has a picture with it of pink and white 56 Chrysler that was with us that day. What a car! In this one class, 27B, there’s a guy with one of each, someone that brings a best of show car every year, one person bringing a trailer load of perfect cars and the 57 Met done in the shade of my driveway.


    After three Second Place trophies, I got a First Grand National in Buffalo in 2004. In 2007 it went to Kalamazoo and brought home a Grand National Senior trophy. With the judging phase of this car over, I enjoy going to the shows, taking my spot in 27B and just admiring the other cars. In class 27D, my 60 Met convertible cruised through the judging and got it’s Grand National Senior in about five shows. Today I got a letter telling me that my Mets have been reclassified as Class 04B, a new class for small cars. There been times I did not think I belonged in class 27B but I enjoyed the competition and never once felt cheated when I did not get the prize I was competing for. I look forward to being able to take a closer look at a different set of cars, but I will be sure to walk over to class 27B to see the prettiest cars shown at an AACA meet.
    Bill

  2. #2
    Senior Member GrayCav56's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Bill,

    I think you have a wonderful post that shows that grit and determination will get you to the destination you seek.

    I have been pondering what to do next with my Corvette. She took her First Junior at Greensburg PA in 2005 and her Senior at Hershey in 2009. I'm not sure if she is at the Grand National level...but I'm pretty biased as I know every pore of her body. Rick Race, a noted Corvette Collector made her a Celebrity Pick at Carlisle again this past fall, so maybe I'll give it a shot.

    Your post has given me the vibe to look into Grand National competition.
    Tony Gray
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  3. #3

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Sometimes perseverance is what makes this hobby worthwhile!

    But the intersting point I picked-up on was the NEW class 04B. What small cars does this entail? Should be a great addition to AACA.

  4. #4
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    All my VW's were added to this new class as well...seems to span the decades. Would love to see the definition or criteria to be in this class.
    Ron Mann
    Historian and Archivist for The Pennsylvania Hill Climb Association (read about it in Oct. 2011 issue of Hemmings)
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  5. #5
    Senior Member sambarn's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    How small is small and what years are covered?? does my Morris Minor get to be in this class?? the 27s are a hard group to compete in!!

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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    I would think, if you didn't get a letter...your car wasn't moved. But....if your Morris Minor isn't in it...I'd be shocked. I heard that VW Buses are also included in this class???
    Ron Mann
    Historian and Archivist for The Pennsylvania Hill Climb Association (read about it in Oct. 2011 issue of Hemmings)
    1965 SCCA/PHA prepared Notchback, 1966 Kombi, 1968 Beetle, 1969 Kombi, 1970 Squareback, 1971 Fastback, 1972 Subaru GL "The Superoo", 1973 Thing, 1976 Puch Newport, 1977 Puch Maxi, 1983 Rabbit LS, 1986 Cabriolet, 1987 Viper "A" Sports Racer, 1996 Harlequin Golf

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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Bill I know what you mean. Matter of fact I think I have been in the same group with you before. The good part of being in that class is we are always the first ones done shining our cars! Doesnt take long to wipe down a Met or a Beetle.
    Will be interesting to see what all is in that class. I was invited to a show this past September that had a class for compacts, in it they also included a few micro cars, made the old beetle look big setting beside some of those.

  8. #8
    Super Moderator Steve Moskowitz's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Guys, sorry I have not been on the computer in a few days. I will check and see if the list is ready for posting. This is a work in progress and represents the request from numerous members to have something akin to a micro car class. The class will probably evolve as more information comes in but those with the smaller cars did not feel they should be parked next to a '59 Cadillac!
    Last edited by Steve Moskowitz; December 2nd, 2010 at 09:08.
    Antique Automobile Club of America
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  9. #9

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Moskowitz View Post
    Guys, sorry I have not been on the computer in a few days. I will check and see if the list is ready for posting. This is a work in process and represents the request from numerous members to have something akin to a micro car class. The class will probably evolve as more information comes in but those with the smaller cars did not feel they should be parked next to a '59 Cadillac!
    Steve, Thanks in advance for posting the list. Personally, I think it wouild be more helpful to post the criteria used to define "smaller cars" (ie physical dimensions, weight, wheel base, or whatever the criteria is). I heard from at least one VW Bus owner that his VW Bus was moved to this class. He too (like Stonefish & myself) is wondering exactly criteria was used to create this new class? If VW Busses were also moved to this class, it would appear that this new class needs some additional tweaking/evolution probably sooner rather than later. By just about anyone's definition a 3000-4000 lb VW Bus with it's size dimensions might be quite a stretch to be considered "small" or "smaller". No doubt, the smaller car owners that were concerned about being parked next to a '59 Cadillac may still not be all that happy about being parked next to a '60s or '70s VW Bus or Camper on the show field either.

    To be honest, having my VW Rabbit in Class 27-N and being moved to 04-B is no big deal for me personally. I will miss the car owners in 27-N as they are a very nice group of people. No doubt, I will find just as many nice people in class 04-B. It will be interesting to see just how many vehicles show up at AACA Meets in Class 04-B. It should be quite an interesting mix of smaller vehicles that I look forward to seeing.
    Charlie

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    Super Moderator Steve Moskowitz's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Sorry, understand the comments but right now I (we) are overwhelmed in this office so at least here is the list.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Antique Automobile Club of America
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  11. #11

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    I don't own a "small car" so the new class doesn't effect me, but what I don't understand is if a VW Rabbit is considered a small car, how come a Chevette or Omni isn't? I mean early Omnis used VW drivetrains. Seems like they need to tweak the classifications?

  12. #12
    Super Moderator Steve Moskowitz's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    "work in progress"..means just that. As we talk to our members and get their input we will absolutely be tweaking these classes just as we did with the high-performance classes and many classes before. This is a START!
    Antique Automobile Club of America
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  13. #13

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    New AACA classes are always interesting. I also do not own a "small" car. Looking over the list, I have to admit, I haven't heard of some of those nameplates.

    I do agree with the above comment regarding Rabbits, Chevettes, and "Omni-rizons". All produced in the same era, why not all included, Pintos too? On the hand, a small car from one era, may not be a "small" car in another. As large cars were downsized, contemperary small cars didn't seem so small. The Metropolitan was small next to a Ford of the same era, whereas a Rabbit didn't seem so small next to a Fairmont of the same year.

    The VW Transporter does seem too large to be considered "small", especially when compared to it's contemporary American 1st generation compact vans. They were relatively the same size.

    A work in progress, it will be interesting to see where this class goes.

  14. #14

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    As I suspected, a few of those on the new class 04 list are already called-out in Class 35-B (Crofton, Playboy, King Midget) because of prototype/ low production. Yes, they are small, but now that's really confusing.

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    Senior Member Jim Bollman's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Seems like the definition should be based on engine size and/or vehicle size (length/wheelbase). Trying to list all possible cars gets real hard when you look at all the foreign micro/mini cars available. Lots of US built micro cars also but many of them were in such small quantities they probably qualify for class 35.
    Jim...

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    Senior Member sambarn's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    So first what about early Datsuns? All the british small family cars like Riley, Wollesley, Austin's family cars? How could the FIAT 500, the vespa's ugly cousin not make the list. Or the Opel non GTs. As far as VWs and Morris Miinors. A VW truck - obviously in truck class. What about a van -a work van or a station wagon, VW RAbbit, Fox and Vanagon for the water cooled classes. One would think that a camper Van would be a family car and if all VW cars (non-trucks) are in the class then what about a Morris Minor van - primarily commercial use but a little nebulous of a list. And the most important question, isn't the Jordan Playboy specifically listed in class 35 as a prototype along with the Keller. Could you choose between the classes if your vehicle overlaps the two? What class would the Keller - a mid size Woodie end up in??

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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Are you saying my car is ugly!!!!?
    You must be referring to some other Fiat 500, not this stunning 51 Fiat 500C.


    The Vintage Microcar Club Cars List defines a micro car as having 1000cc or less. That category excludes all Mets, but is a huge list. Maybe a better definition for Class 04 would be any production vehicle after a certain year with less than 1000cc plus these listed cars.

    Although in another thread I was opposed to a carnival side show of BatMobiles, and Oscar Meyer Weiners, this will be an interesting class. The Fiat pictured here was parked next to a beautiful Mercedes Gull Wing one afternoon and the Gull Wing became invisible. The owner expressed his displeasure of letting cars like that into a show.

    Bill Clark
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    60 Met Class 04
    55 Studebaker Speedster Class 27A
    51 Fiat 500C Class 26C
    It does have the big engine in it, bringing it up to a whopping 16 HP, but there is no High Performance class for a 51.

  18. #18

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Bill, thanks for the link to the Micro Car Club. Viewed the Gallery for a bit, but plan to retrun to look more when I have time. I agree, this class will be interesting when the list is "tweaked" and owners know where their vehicle belongs. should be a crowd pleaser!

  19. #19
    Senior Member-1951 Model Shop Rat's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    By far one of the cutest photos ever posted here on the forums.
    Susan W. Linden

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  20. #20

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    I look forward to the new class. I think that the competition will be harder, but change is good.

    That said, I do not know if they thought about this when "talking to the members" as you put my DKW universal next to a peel and small is not want comes to mind.

    I for one will be happy to be out of the class I was in last year at Hershey. The man next to me said "not sure why they let those foreign jobbies in this class" I guess the cuteness factor can put some people off.

  21. #21

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Anyone heard of other new AACA classes or updates other than to accommodate the '86's?

  22. #22
    Junior Member volxy's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    I have to agree that putting these ''small cars'' in a class by it's self is a great idea..I know my vw looked a little out of place next to a full size american made vehicle @ Hershey,but the only thing I don't understand is how they consider all volkswagens air and H2O small when there are so many variations between both and there are dodge omni's not included in this class..mabee they need to tweek it a little more and call it a sub compact class that could cover those early models starting in the early 70's such as pintos,chevetts, citations,vega's,omni's,honda's,datsun's,saab's,ra bbit's,scirroco's...I just think a class that covers years from the 40's to the 80's is to broad,car's of this nature from the 40's to 60's were meant to be cheap transportation and SIMPLE,then by the 70's people started to want more room and creature comforts for longer journeys but staying small..I just think splitting the years in half 40's/60's-70's/90's would make for better viewing and judging and a lot more fare to the member's showing,since these cars are much more simpler from older to newer.

  23. #23

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    Work in progress?
    How about a premature nightmare.
    I've sat back and read the postings for the last month - after receiving the letter in November informing me that my vehicle had been moved to class 4B. Albeit with no explanation in the letter of what defined class 4B (heck I pulled out the judging manual and tried to figure out how a 4 cylinder, 4 cycle powered vehicle was electric powered - since that was what class 4 was/is) - anyway, now that I've digested the "List" I wonder what thought (if any) went into this reclassification?
    It's been stated that this was done in response to member's comments/desires. I question which members were polled regarding this change? Those with these "small vehicles" or those with "large vehicles"?
    Owning three vehicles that fall under this loose classification - none of which would make sense sitting side by side on a showfield - I have to question the logic used to get us to this point.
    Can we at least refine the classification by seating capacity, engine displacement and wheelbase - possibly using the decade of manufacture as a chronological differentiation? Our judging system is better than this - let's demonstrate the logic that 75 years of experience should have taught us.

  24. #24

    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    "Work in progress" means it was hastely conceived and we're not sure where this is going. Several other new AACA classes have been referred to as a work in progress and are really confusing.

    Simple: the size of a vehicle is determined by length and wheelbase. Decide what is small and put it in the rulebook. Also, a decade breakdown would be helpful. Arbitrarily selecting make and model because someone thinks it's a small car is not the way to go.

    And why a sub-class of electric vehicles? I thought 04B was a typo, and was meant to 40B.

    This class has potential if created properly.

  25. #25
    Senior Member sambarn's Avatar
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    Re: Moved to Class 04B

    And it would take up less space than many other classes!!

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