Foreign car junk yards...check for accumulators

[Barney Eaton]

Does anyone on the forum have Foreign car junk yards in their area?
I just checked with SAAB parts department and the accumulator number used on SAAB's is 4002267 (I think Padgett posted a number last week but I can't find it) A new part list for just under $400. But if GM stops stocking them we need to find another source.

I have been told that Jaguar and Mercedes also used the Teves system.
So if you are junking, look at some cars and try to verify the size of their accumulator. Depending on the price, you might pick up a used one and try it.

Secondly, I am thinking of ways we could test accumulators. If any of you have a background in hydraulics, maybe we could make a hand pump with gage and rig up at test fixture. I'm thinking it would need to measure pressure and have a way of measuring how much fluid goes into the accumulator with a certain amount of pressure. Any thoughts?

[nic walker]

Padgetts Post from the 20th:

padgett
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Loc: Orlando, Florida, occasionaly Re: more * Teves * brake system questions please.... [Re: inthespot]
#460021 - 04/20/07 09:42 AM Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply



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[Jim]

Junk yards are actually not a very good source. A couple of weeks ago I went to several yards and picked up 9 accumulators. I then tested them one at a time on my car and checked for the number of pumps it took for the red light to come on. Out of the 9 I had one that took 4 pumps which would be average since a new accumulator takes about 7. I had one that came on in three pumps and all the rest came on in two or less. I saved the 4 pump and the 3 pump and threw the rest away.
I then took my sawzall and cut one in half. It was just a steel housing with a rubber bladder inside. Even on the accumulator that was totally out of nitrogen I could not push a rod into the bottom hole so there must have been a little pressure in there. After I cut one open I could then push the bladder into the housing.
If a person did have some sort of pump that went to 2600 pounds you could measure the amount of fluid that goes in and compare it to a new one. The more fluid the accumulator takes the worse it is so you would first have to know how much a new one holds.
One tip if you do go to junk yards, if there is a white label on the accumulator it is a replacement and the odds of it being good are better than an original one although a while back I did get one with the white label on it and it was no good.

[mongeonman]

I went to a foreign junk yard where they had bmw,jag,volvo,mercedes,ect and they looked for an accumulator like the one in the reatta and they said that the ones they had found were much bigger,and did not fit the reatta.I think the easiest way to test accumulators would be to buy a gage like the one they show in the FSM and test it like they say ,it would cost much less than building an hydraulis system.

[F14CRAZY]

How come with all 6 Reattas I've touched, even with 3 new accumualtors, I never got over 3 pumps?

[EDBS0]

Accumulators on the rear shocks of my Mercedes.

They are everywhere!!

[Barney Eaton]

Thanks for the picture, can you tell if the accumulator screws into the fitting and is the threads on the accumulator the same as the Reatta? Also is the Reatta and Mercedes accumulators the same size (any chance of a side by side picture)?

If they are the same, what years Mercedes and was it standard suspension on what model?

[mongeonman]

If you go on E BAY under "accumulator"you will find 3 new ones that fit REATTA,prices starting 125.00.

[EDBS0]

Different <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />.

1986 190E 2.3 16V Cosworth. 1,888 in North America.

[F14CRAZY]

Caterpillar dozers also have accumulators

[Booreatta]

Barney you might want to check Fords also the Thunderbird Turbo used the same Teves system and the accumulators look about the same. I have not checked it out completely but it looks the same

[padgett]

Watch out for "PowerMaster"s - was a GM electrohydraulic boost (no ABS) system that used a similar accumulator but was half the pressure.

Sounds like we need a way to drill/tap/install a fitting and find a way to charge to 700 psi (preferably with Nitrogen). Will require a supply of ded accumulators so it might be a good idea to save. I suspect most could be just recharged.

[DAVES89]

I was just at a u-pick yard and saw 6 w/o looking to hard. What cars should I be looking at and how do they come off? Counterclockwise, but by hand or do I use a tool or oil filter wrench? I will grab them and send to whoever wants to do the testing. I did notice that the ones I looked at in the yard does not have a made in Germany [white] sticker like mine does. Does that mean mine has been replaced? My pressure sensor also has a white sticker.

[Shelby]

The problem I see is that there is not an easy way to check to see if used accumulators are good.

And athough a new one is $125 it seems like a reasonable price to pay for a part that will last about 5-10 years.

[Shelby]

Oh if you are looking at the Caterpillar dealer these fit 953C track loader.

But the Cat dealer wants $249

[Rawja]

Maybe someone shoud contact Prior Remanufacting and see where they source theirs from or if they are up for supplying the accumulator on its own. I would be shocked if GM's discontinuance of the part will mean much of anything in the long term useability of the Teves system.

I for one am not worried in the slightest about finding an accumulator at some future date.

[Jim]

I also thought of recharging the accumulators but not sure how it would be done. Here are some picture of an accumulator cut in half.
I am guessing the factory pressurized the accumulator from the top and the welded it shut.
Pix 1 shows the bladder in the bottom half.
Pix 2 shows the top.
It looks like inside the hex there might be a slug inserted and then spot welded as shown in pix 3.
In pix 3 you can see a tiny hole with a blue ring around it from being very hot.
The metal piece on top with the hex is also welded to the housing.

[tempest68]

I would like to know if anyone has successfully re-engineered the braking system using OEM GM parts in such a was as to eliminate the use of the accumulator. If I remember correctly, the '91 did not use the same setup as the '88-'90s. Is it a moderate project or just a complete nightmare to consider converting to the '91 style system?

[padgett]

The TEVES has an ABS module in the trunk. For the 91 Delco unit, it uses part of the ECM to control the ABS which would mean integrating your ECM software into the ABS-capable ECM, a new wiring harness, and whatever other components are rquired.

What many have done is to convert to a Riviera style non-ABS poer brake system. That just requires plumbing.

[DAVES89]

There is an '89 Riv. in the local u-pick yard. When you say plumbing what parts do I need exactly? This Riv does not have the Teves brake system. Also if anyone out there has the long console piece from a Riv. with the burled wood look I would be interested in talking to you. I have all the other parts.

[tempest68]

Thanks Padgett for the info. I did not realize the Riv's were different. My wife and I both dislike ABS systems in the winter-time here in the Northeast. On a patch of ice the ABS on any of our cars seems to prolong the stopping times instead of reducing it. I'm sure certain situations ABS is great, but snow and ice conditions are not one of them.

[F14CRAZY]

Ah yes, the Rivi vacuum powered system. We go for those because Teves was optional on the Rivi, but standard on Reattas

[Reattaron]

I can get the console trim piece you need. Let me know your e-mail address. They're plentiful in the j. yards around here.

[Richard S]

While wandering around the yards here, I noted that the Caddy Seville's used an Ate ABS system that seems to incorporate our accumulators. Can't find a part number for it though. I guess we gave up on trying to find a way to re-pressurize or test them other than put them on the car and hope for the best.

[imported_REATAMANZ]

Barney,
GM first used accumulators in the mid to late 80's. They used a US company that bought them from a German company. Teves had to supply the ABS system to other platforms probably in Europe. The supplier that GM bought from was called Intergral Hydraulic in Enfield Ct. If someome like yourself would contact them, they maybe able and willing to give you who their supplier in Germany was. Telephone number is 860-745-7932 our contact was a man named Godried Kusters. GM part we bought was 18015032--this part has nothing to do with Reattas.